Why I NEVER play my Vintage Gibson
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- čas přidán 1. 06. 2024
- I often get asked why I don't play my Gibson ES175 more often. This is the story of that jazz guitar and how I ran into a few problems with it.
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Content:
00:00 Intro
00:29 The Strat and The Audition
01:43 Finding the Gibson
03:28 Problems With The Sound
05:43 Thunk
06:19 Jazz Guitar Tone: Is It A Myth?
06:33 Do I Hate P90s
08:25 Why I Am Not Changing The Pickup
09:18 It Was Stolen!
10:15 What The Guitar Is Great For
10:45 The Great $400 Guitar I Used On 5 albums
My name is Jens Larsen, Danish Jazz Guitarist, and Educator. The videos on this channel will help you explore and enjoy Jazz. Some of it is how to play jazz guitar, but other videos are more on Music Theory like Jazz Chords or advice on how to practice and learn Jazz, on guitar or any other instrument.
The videos are mostly jazz guitar lessons, but also music theory, analysis of songs and videos on jazz guitars.
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I thought it would be a good idea to end the year with the story of my Gibson ES175.
Here's the video on my cheap Jazz guitar: czcams.com/video/bIQiWfeWLA4/video.html
I love ❤❤❤❤ that guitar. Probably because of my association with other players who have used it. For me, it’s the guitar of choice for 1950’s jump blues!
I should not like to play a stolen instrument . That's the only problem with your ES 175 . I do like
P90 on my ES 150 and humbuckers on my 69 Byrdland . Each one has his voice and I feel they
are complementary , adding different and various and subtle nuances . About stolen instrument
my only bad experience is about the wandre doris I lended long time ago to a french/ german
fellow ( HARALD GLASS ).....before he disapeared with the guitar . They call it FRENCH / GERMAN friendship !!!!!!
@@jean-lucbersou758 Any instrument that is more than 50 years old has a very high chance of having been stolen at some point. You can't know unless you speak to the original buyer, and that is not very likely.
@@JensLarsen Curious answer .....and I don't understand the " is not very likely " . You
may have a bill and garantee papers , the foam number and know the origine of the instrument . The french law consider that if you buy a stolen thing you make harbour or
conceal ( generally thing that seems low prices good affairs ) . Another main thing is to
contract insurance .policy while being vigilant .
@@jean-lucbersou758 How much experience do you have with buying vintage guitars?
Old guitars have often had a few owners, so you are unlikely to be talking to whoever bought it new.
If you buy a guitar from the 50s or 60s then you can't expect to get receipts and guarantee papers. That is almost never the case, and you can check serial numbers if it has been listed as stolen but that doesn't go back to the 80s which leaves a 30 to 40 year gap of unknown.
It's not like ordering from Thomann or Andertons 🙂
A very long time ago, a very wise guitarist pulled my wife to the side and advised her to never allow me to part with my ‘67 S400 CES. It has lived with me since '69. The wife has been with me since '76. I am going to keep them both.
Yes, I indeed 🙂
I did add a subscription to your link though not sure how it will work
@S. E. Schule
Hey friendo, just a heads up but that comment that starts with telegram me is a scam bot. It has nothing to do with this channel, you see em on lots of videos all pretending to be from the host. Best to just ignore or report them. Don’t hand over any money.
Not sure if you know this or not but be safe and have a good rest of the year. Peace!
@@thomasharris7881 That is very good to know. Thanks for the heads up!
K lmk
The right guitar is always the same. The right guitar is the one you most enjoy playing, and find most inspiring.
Haha, thanks for the shout out. I would say that since I got the 335, I’m mostly playing that. That said getting that guitar really helped me appreciate the special qualities of the 175 and stop trying to make it be something it isn’t. I usually know right away when I want to use one or the other.
You're very welcome, Christian! I often like your take on things :)
Years ago, I had a 1950 ES-150 which had a 17" body and the original P90. It's still the greatest sounding pickup I've ever heard. Those 1950s P-90s are just magical.
Jim Hall's ES-175 was originally owned by Howard Roberts and many of Howard's early recordings were made with that guitar. I really like Howard's tone on those recordings as it has a certain acoustic quality that appeals to me.
I own a 1980 HR Fusion. HR is God. IMHO
I did the opposite: when I was working as a musician for pop artists I used an archtop because I thought i looked badass. It was kind of trendy at the time. Yes the sound engineers did not appreciate that then I started to play Jazz and then I got a nylon string Godin
We all need to find out own way :) Happy new year Mikko!
As a guitar player who hasnt even started learning Jazz yet,i love dropping by and hearing your stories and teaching Jens
Thank you, Nick! That is really great to hear!
Jens, you are a modern person. You hear something that the arch top can’t give. We have different influences. I tried an arch top more than once, and I sold them all.
I used to own an ES-175T. It's one of only two guitars which I have ever owned and I absolutely regret selling. I miss it very much.
You must remember that the amp is 1/2 of the formula. I have a 1962 Fender Bandmaster which is more of a mid-range amp. Sounds fabulous when I run my '50s American Original Stratocaster through it, with most of the guitar's treble rolled off on the instrument.
Keep the 175 forever, you'll be glad you did. I think it sounds beautiful. Sometimes you just need more than one guitar. SO play the Ibanez or 335. I have many guitars and really enjoy picking up one I haven't played for a while and enjoying the difference. Different guitars make you play different things in a different way. That's a good thing!
As I said in the video, it is not for sale, and it has it's place in what I do for a living, it just is not my own music 🙂
@@JensLarsen Jens, I seem to recall Grant Green sounding awesome with single coil 😉.. anyway, there
are various instruments and setups that are suitable for Jazz, but IME a Strat is not one of them! 😂 Luckily they said you’re in…🥳
You must’ve played your bum off. 👏
Happy Holidays!❄️⛄️
Fighting GAS is a real struggle.
Archtops are really cool tho... you should get it. You deserve it.
Haha! Thanks :)
I've had a similar experience. To my ear, semi-hollow bodies and even some solid guitars (specifically the Parker Fly) are FAR LESS trouble in bands where some charts are swing, others bossa, or funk, and especially rock. The hollow bodies just don't have enough flexibility to handle those styles. Thanks for the video. It was very affirming for me.
Glad you like it!
Not a comment on this video in particular, but Jens has the best guitar channel on CZcams. I checked out a bunch of his videos. I have a diploma of Jazz and I enjoy checking out even his beginner vids all the way up. I had a laid back teacher and he didn't get I to too much good stuff. I was playing in a country band while in school and did some great gigs in Arenas and stuff so he knew where I was going and my time restrsints as I had many other songs to learn for my job. He was surprised by Brent Mason solos and gave my craft some extra respect. I wish looking back I had the time to dedicate myself to jazz. I understood all the theoretical aspects and did very well but actually playing jazz I was pretty weak. Technically I'm a good player but I didn't have the repitiore or bag of licks. Watching these videos years later my curiosity is peaked and jumping in being able to play well already is a total treat. I love these videos. How well he explains himself. Examples with tab. This channel is so great for middle aged musicians with experience looking to branch out as well as beginners. So well done! Thanks for getting me back into jazz!!
Thank you very much, Mark! It is really great to hear that you find the videos helpful and put it to use 🙂
Great story Jens. Can't wait to see and hear what you come up with in 2023.
I have a ´58 es 175 with humbuckers (PAFs) and it behaves in a similar way as yours. Lacks a bit of sustain but has the sweetest jazztone you can imagine. Keep it bro.
No worries! I was not planning to sell it :)
About pick attack: After years of upgrading guitars by swapping pickups, I bought a PRS SE Custom 22 (solidbody, maple neck) right after that model got discontinued. The stock neck pickup was everything I thought I didn't want: It wasn't "articulate," it was pillowy and diffuse. Then I took it to a jazz rehearsal, and - wow! Its soft attack blends beautifully with other instruments. This has changed my whole ear. Guitar has always been an outlier in jazz, as a pizzicato party-crasher in a genre defined by legato wind instruments. The more we can soften our attack, the more welcome we sound. This is why jazz guitar's '70s fusion generation jumped on chorus FX and choruslike dual delays - they soften attack.
Someone once wrote that a 175 has been "the sound of recorded jazz guitar for decades." I think of its "thunk" as "bark," plus some chirp from all the maple. It's a beautiful sound in its own right. But as someone who grew up with rock music and solidbodies, I'm with Jens: I want more sustain.
You never fail to address very interesting topics in a refreshing way. I never thought about using a semi-hollow for jazz until I purchased a D'Angelico Kurt Rosenwinkel. I didn't know who he was, but also never saw a semi-hollow with a spruce top for a lefty like myself. The sustain is addictive and useful even for copying legato saxophone lines. Thanks Jens for sharing your perspective, I'll be keeping this semi too!
8:36 I like the Rick Beato cameo.👍
Plus one for Christian miller videos! Have you considered new design arch top guitars like Ken Parker's? Oh yeah, hope you have a good new year! 👍🏼
I recently bought a Hagstrom Alvar. I love it !
Great! Congrats on that 🙂
awesome video
i had a similar experience with a hollow body, and changing the the wooden saddle for a harder material (metal, in my case) helped a bit.
This was awesome, really cool to see your personal relationship with each guitar!
Glad you enjoyed it, Ross!
In the late 1980s I auditioned for a jazz / studio music program with a *Squire* Stratocaster. Every other kid in the waiting room had a jazz box. I was accepted but chose to attend engineering school instead. I never stopped playing but I often wonder how my life might have unfolded had I taken that other path. At the time my friends were rockers and several of them make a good living today as musicians. I had read an article in Guitar Player about Will Lee being a sessions player in New York and thought that sounded cool. I'm happy you went down the other road Jens!
80s Squiers made in Japan are great and even better than some Fenders.
Nice video! I always loved the "old guitar sounds" and also p90 tones. But its real anyone has one opinion about the sound and signal. And the feeling you get during playing tells much too. We will always keep trying to figure out about the clean gain control stuff. Nice to check you out playing other guitars! Thank you for sharing this.
great video and funny too. I guess the owner recognized his instrument by the tailpiece.
Among other things 🙂
I like "thunk"! Used a 175 in a rock band for years. Loved the clarity in the attack.
Used stereo 100 watt twins. No prob w/ feedback, and it sustained adequately w/ MXR distortion.
The only guitar that I had an instant love for and also had a neck that sat perfect in my hand was an Gibson ES 175.
The most expensive in the shop at the time. So after testing some other brands I went home and continued with my
beloved solid body Ibanez JEM -97. But maybe someday...
Great video Jens. The 175 definitely has some mojo to it but I understand why you rely on you Ibanez more. I was torn a couple years ago on whether to get a Jazz Box or go semi hollow. I went with an inexpensive HB-35Plus, swapped the pickups for a set of Seth Lover Seymour Duncan’s and put a set of Grovers in. Absolutely love the guitar and it is more comfortable for me than a bigger Jazz Box.
Anyway, thank you for all you do and the GREAT videos this year. You are much appreciated my friend. Looking forward to 2023 with you
I will never be able to play like Jens, but I can enjoy his stories, watch these cool videos and wait for more old band footage/concerts!! I need to drink beer with Jens! You are FAMOUS in Cincinnati!
about a year ago I bought a Chinese clone of the ES-125-T, and I love it. its a one trick pony - not a guitar for all seasons, but good for slide and a few other things. I won't try to compare it with a vintage Gibson, but considering it cost less than $200, I think its pretty cool.
Nice video. It's good that the guitar found you. Adopting guitars is always good. XD
Very true 🙂 Thanks Andres
Amazing insights. Thank you for sharing! This is a video I've watched many times.
Glad it was helpful!
I am playing my two Hofners and one with a Dearmond Rythmn Chief 1000 and 012. Flats. It's my bread and butter guitar for Indie Rock(Folk). I play it with a good amount of treble and a bit reverb and it fits for that
I can relate. Luckily I was studying at the uni with an archtop and got really into Wes. I haven't gotten the semi yet but I'm so excited for that extra sustain.
My audition was with a 1972 Gibson SG. Later I did get a 335 (1980 model) and loved playing it but always wanted to get a 175, which later I could finally afford. However I felt the same thing, that I could not get a modern singing tone out of the 175, though it was a 1970 double hum bucker and played beautifully, and after I put flatwound strings on it, it was even more dead. So I use the 335 the most for my jazz playing, but do get out the 175 now and then. I typically use 11s, using the neck pickup with anywhere from 1 to 4 on the tone pot. Add to that a bit of reverb and delay and it is a very nice experience for my ears. I use a 60 watt Fender Supersonic tube amp, which is typically way more power than I need for jazz gigs, but gives me the overhead I need for the clean articulate sound I want. I used to have a Twin, but that amp is for a younger, stronger man, so eventually I had to sell it.
I own an Epiphone Es175 Premium and when I bought it used in 2018, I installed 11-50 flat strings (ECG24). I had an Emperor II for a very long time mounted in 12-52 and when I got this 175 mounted with a set of round strings I searched on the official Epiphone website what was originally mounted on it and it was indeed 11 round strings.
I found that the 11-50 strings had more sustain than the 12-52s. More comfort, more sustain, I've been playing with these strings for 5 years now and I'm really happy with them.
Great that you have an approach that works 🙂
Happy New Year, Jens, and to all fellow musicians enjoying your site.
@1:59, the arrow is pointed at the wrong shop. This is now a legit Key Music store. You probably bought your guitar one house to the right, where The Guitar Man used to be. They specialized in vintage guitars and I, regrettably, sold my ‘74 Jazz Bass (bought in a San Diego pawn shop so who knows where that came from) to them in the late nineties. I know, because I grew up right at the other side of that big churchtower! Fun fact: we lived above my dad’s store which was located across the street from Servaas, which, for years, was the largest music store in the Netherlands. Seeing the vans of The Hagues’s international rock legends such as Golden Earring and Earth&Fire pull up in front of our house was one of the reasons I wanted to play guitar.
Now back on topic: tried several archtops but now play jazz on a Yamaha SA2200 (when bought used the best bang for the buck if you want a 335 style guitar) for exactly the reasons you mentioned. Just listen to Larry Carlton’s comping on the early Michael Franks record to convince you how jazzy a 335 can sound. Also, people will actually be able to hear what you play at gigs. Generally, at the gigs I play, the audience does not exactly sit quietly gawking at the musicians. And it’s so much more versatile if you also play blues, rock, fusion…
Cheers, Anton
I bought and played an 1958 ES175 in the late 80's for my studies in music. From what I remember it sounded and played great but it has been too long now to know if that was really the case, after spending the following 30 years of playing on dozens of other guitars and progressing as a guitarist. In 2012 I bought a brand new ES175 and I totally struggled with it. No sustain and that dead feeling (or thunk) when I played it. Sold it with frustrated disapointment. In 2013 I bought a brand new Ibanez PM200 and was blown away the second I played it. Easy action, great sustain and the pick-up (designed by PM and the Ibanez team) sounds like a dream, with no feedback live. The workmanship on this guitar is flawless. Top quality...and I am still loving it to this day.
My dream jazz guitar sound is the old Jim Hall’s smoky p90 sound. The tone of making me feel like being in a purgatory between “coming out” or “not quite coming out” is just right for smoky jazz tone, but if someone playing smoking jazz runs, the purgatory feels very frustrating😊
I have a 1965 ES-175D. Lots of mojo, but I could never get it playing well until I took it to a luthier here in NYC recently. Now -- OH. MY. GOD. Thanks Matt at 30th St. Guitars!
Very informative. I sometimes dream about arctop, but my semihollownis more suited for my playingstyle. And thanks for the explosive amp.
I have had what looks like a twin to yours which is a 1952 ES-175 since I was a kid in the 80s. Love that guitar.
Great! :)
I`m 67 and got rid of most of my guitars! I was a Gibson guy, but I bought Heritage Guitars which are much better than Gibson! I kept my 1993 Heritage 535 (same as Gibson 335) and my Godin nylon string and couldn`t be happier! I was told my Heritage was made by the old Gibson luthiers and I`ve never heard a better 335 like my Heritage and the Godin is wonderful especially on stage! I also owned a Heritage Sweet 16, and Johny Smith, wish I kept the Sweet 16 but as I get older, I would rather it`s out there working than in my closet and played once in a while! These 2 guitars I have couldn`t be better, can play any style of music and the sound is just beautiful! I`m glad you did this story bc I always believed what you said about Jazz Guitars, I liked them but something about that 335 that just sounds and plays really great with an old and modern feel!
this was very helpful. thank you
You're welcome!
9:02 this is the line I use to literally anyone who will listen!
Interesting to hear that Jim Hall turned down his volume as this is what I have independently come to do when playing a P-90 guitar
Hi Jens. I hope your Christmas was merry and bright, with yuletide carols being sung, well maybe not by a choir. I enjoy hearing them sung by Carmen MacRae or Nat King Cole. Maybe you could share your preferences with us all in a video?
Anyway, I enjoyed your playing, very much. Those few seconds there when you were demonstrating the sustain on the old Gibson were magical. Have you ever done a solo recording of standards? That sounded great -- even with that beautiful old Gibson with the ugly P-90.
Thanks for the video.
The 175 was the first jazz guitar I initially wanted, but settled for an Epiphone 335 which served me well. I now play an Ibanez artcore expressionist af95 which I'm happy with. Just a little wider body than a 335 and no feedback issues.
I was surprised about your feelings regarding your ES-175, but after you explained your reasoning, it made perfect sense to me. When I was playing in the 70s and 80s, I would have considered an ES-175 as useless due to feedback and lack of sustain. Now I have a 2016 175 that is a jazz player’s dream. That guitar inspires me.
Hi Lars. I really enjoyed this presentation. Sustain from a wooden saddle and a flat-ish string break-angle over the saddle, necessitated from the trapeze tailpiece, is weak. I love thunk.
Hey bruh. Great video. Glad you kept the axe.
I am always amazed at how Steve Howe navigated his way to rock stardom with a 175!!
Your story with the Stevie Ray Vaughan guitar reminded me of a story. I studied jazz guitar at Humber College in Canada and during auditions there were two students sitting in the hallway wood- shedding before their audition. One turns to the other and says do you know your harmonic minors ? And the other student goes yeah and begins to play a bunch of open harmonics on his strings and then the other student says no man. I think it’s a scale.
Happy new year!🇨🇦
I always enjoy your videos Jens. You are the master! I'm curious about your opinion of the Taylor T5 Koa . It would be cool if you reviewed that guitar. I love mine.
amazing sound out of that guitar. wow.
Thanks! You can hear it in action here: czcams.com/video/rlKu7tGyNLc/video.html
I like the "thunk" of that old guitar of yours! It sounds real vintage and is plain perfect for retro sounds. Hard to get! For more modern and sustainy stuff I'd go all the way to a solid body, maybe even a tele rather than strat.
Lol, I have always wondered why I've never seen you play the 175 in any vids. This is a great video, and your 175 is remarkable.
After years of also playing a strat with flats when I finally got an es175 with humbuckers, a whole new world of sustain opened up to me. I also love how it plays so I'm thinking that your suspicions about the p90s might be correct. I personally do roll the tone down because I like that warm more muffled sound. I still think the articulation sounds pretty strong.
I've been practicing researching 80s pop and rock all my life so i have a Jackson dinky, a Strat, and a few ibanezes, that's what I've been learning your + TILFBH CZcams material on! i just roll off the volume + tone pots to taste and it works for me.
Really nicely explained and illustrated. I've never come across the term "thunk" before - but it's a really good onomatopoeic description of a classic sound. Ironically, while it wasn't what you needed from your vintage Gibson, it's exactly what I'm hearing in my mind's ear, but not achieving, for one of my numbers I'm rehearsing with a new band. You've put your finger precisely on why simply turning down the tone on any of my guitars isn't creating the "thunk" I want to hear!
Glad it was helpful! That is a funny coincidence 😁
The ES175 does sound beautiful! Perfect explanation of the sustain and attack "issue" though. Still, not a bad problem to have 🙂
Thanks! Yes, it sounds great! :)
I like the thunk. I would like more it.
Pipe cleaners around the strings on the other side of the trapeze bridge helps a little.
I have a good Strat and ES 335 but I've often wondered what it would be like to have an ES 175. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experiences re this Jens. 😃
Always great to see you at the premiere Kevin :) Thank you!
@@JensLarsen Thanks Jens. It's fun to be here and say 'Woooo !!'
A few years back while on vacations in the netherlands i visited that guitar shop 😁 i recognized that street immediately
Well, actually there were 3 shops in that street next to each other and this one closed in '99 so you may not have been there :)
@@JensLarsen Oh ok, i was there in 2018 - seems i was mistaken 😁
Jens. The Gibson sounds like a big warm blanket. It’s beautiful
Great video Jens!
Thank you, Jostein! Glad you liked it 🙂
I play an old 65 es 335 because that's the one that the stars aligned for as far as purchasing wise. I really like the big broad sound of a 175 with the humbucker though especially with some nice reverb a la Kreisburg. I loved Jim Halls sound with the P90 the performance of God Bless The Child with Sonny Rollins is sublime. The sound is like pure water droplets. I guess it's in the fingers as well.
I always say that a P90'd hollowbodied guitar is more like a marimba or xylophone, whereas a humbuckered one is more like a glockenspiel or vibes. Different strengths for different things.
Are you possibly hearing what I refer to as 175 "string buzz" on most of the strings . I definitely hear it .. Mine had that same sound until I replaced the wooden bridge with a Tune-o-matic Bridge for Archtops from StewMac. I still hear it a bit on the open 1st string . Nice guitar Jens . I would probably just stare at it most of the day ... Never sell it ; you will regret it . Happy New Year !!!
That was fun. My kid lent me his Sheraton. As my shoulder recovers -- which is coming along great -- I'll give it a go.
Great that you are getting better! 🙂 Have fun with the Sheraton!
@@JensLarsen Yes, if any of your folks have destroyed their rotator cuffs, know that there is hope -- knives, saws, ingenious inventions, and hope. But be prepared for your Deltoid muscle to have to learn everything you knew, almost from scratch.
One significant aspect you didn't address is the guitar's bridge. The wooden saddle is a major factor in the "thunk". Replace it with a TOM style metal unit atop the wooden bridge base and the attack and sustain will be radically altered. I did this years ago on my '80s Ibanez AF200 after encountering the same problem playing more modern jazz. Problem fixed.
You can always stick the old wooden saddle back on - easily reversible modification. The trick is finding one with the right string spacing - ideally one where the saddles aren't pre-slotted.
Anyway, you've presented a nice discussion here of tonal expectations/preconceptions relating to jazz guitars. Cheers.
Loved it in the Big Band " is that stolen? " Lmao 🤣😜
Great video , that guitar tho , not only does it have history it's a beautiful piece of wood .. the authentic sounds it's like you're almost there ..
Thanks Jens 👌🎸🎶🎶😎
Glad you enjoyed it
If you want more sustain on your ES175, just replace the rosewood bridge to a regular ABR-1 🤝… Naylon saddles will let it sound still warm and woodie. Of course your setup need to be perfect too👍 Herb Ellis & a lot of other Jazz guitarist did the same. By the way, the tailpice of your ES175 has been changed to a ES125 style ;-) … that and the bright fretboard color were definitely what the previous owner recognized it by 🤝
Beautiful guitar! Keep it and enjoy it 👍
If you change the bridge to a metal-sadlle tuneomatic type archtop bridge you will get more sustain.
I did that with my ES175D and it made a huge difference.
It is the strings on the wood bridge that kills the sustain.
I ONLY play my vintage Gibson. Thanks for this video (and all the ones I get thanks to my Patreon subscription.) After owning a Strat I inherited a 1969 ES-330TD with the P-90's. A teacher I had many years ago told me to get a Polytone Minibrute amp for it and that combination creates what I think is the definitive "jazz guitar sound." Due to a physical limitation (several broken arms doing dumb kid stuff when I was younger) I have some limited motion in my fretting hand/arm and anything thicker than a thinline causes discomfort for extended playing. I guess I am fortunate that the sound I get is the one I like because I'm out of luck if I want to sound different.
Very recognisable. I keep going back and forth between a hollow body with flat wounds, a semi-hollow with round wounds and a strat with round wounds. You could make them sounds more similar (round wounds or half rounds on the hollow, flats on the semi). But i guess it makes more sense to have every guitar do its own thing. If I could only have one (and that would make live easier and make you focus just on the music) I might be looking more for a compromise. I guess I would then still stick with the round wound 11's on the semi and play around with the tone. That in itself covers a lot of ground. Or a good strat.
This is just excellent. I'm looking at possibly buying either an IBANEZ AM2000H or an Ibanez AF-2000 Artstar Prestige Hollowbody or
an Ibanez AS-2000 Artstar Prestige Semi Hollowbody. This video very helpful.
I've been loving catching up on your videos and the wisdom you bring to your audience! There's tons of opinions out there that disagree but there's others who appreciate jazz and relate with how your journey has unfold. I've went through a dozen guitars the last 40 years from my first Ibanez Les Paul Custom to a Taylor 814ce and everything in between. My conclusion was find the guitar that plays the way you want to play even if it doesn't sound perfect but then find the right pickups and make it your own. Spending thousands of dollars on a popular brand doesn't always work best for the player. I sold most of the expensive guitars and I'm hunting for a semi-hollow for my next guitar. The sound from your Sheraton with the bare knuckle pickups sounds sweet! Anyway, keep posting when you get some time and looking forward to the next video, with or without the explosions! 👍
Glad you like the videos 🙂 good luck with the guitar hunt!
Hey Jens. Sorry I’m just now seeing this video from you. What a great topic. I’ve always wanted to hear more about that mysterious 175 on your wall and to know your thoughts about it!
As an everyday player/performer of a 1953 or maybe 1954 ES-175 that looks EXACTLY like yours (my serial number has been blotted out with a smear of black ink or tar that looks as vintage as the guitar itself), I can really relate to what you are talking about here!
I agree with you about so many things. Particularly how comfortable and playable the neck is. That in itself makes this a hard guitar to ever abandon. Playability is huge, and I’ve never found a guitar that feels better in my hands. This is the only guitar I’ve ever owned that allows me to sometimes get into that headspace where I forget there’s a physical instrument between me and my musical thoughts. This has everything to do with the size of the body, the scale of the neck, the action of the strings-all it it. Only the 175 has that magic for me so far.
While I generally agree with you about the idiosyncrasies of the single coil P-90, it doesn’t bother me. I knew those issues going in. Funny that you wound up trying to make your 175 sound more like a solid body by adding effects. I spent years trying to make my solid bodies sound more like a hollow body using different amps and effects! Then one day I had a simple epiphany: if you want your sound to be like joe pass or Jim hall’s, the plainly obvious way to do that is just to go to the vintage guitar store and buy the very same instrument they used! It was easy (although not necessarily on my wallet).
Your observation about pickups is spot-on. Maybe you SHOULD put in a humbucker! As long as you can find one that fits into the body without any new hole-cutting, what’s to lose?
I say this because I replaced mine and have no regrets. It’s an interesting story. At the risk of boring you with too much detail I’ll say that I also wound up owning an early 1950’s ES-140, the smaller scale version of the 175. It is kind of a travel guitar maybe. A novelty guitar really. Smaller scale. Not too playable, but cool. And it also has a single P-90. But THIS P-90 sounded so much hotter and fuller than the one in my 175. I asked my go-to luthier if he knew why. And he told me the Gibson factory in Kalamazoo in the early 50’s could often be inconsistent. The pickups were actually wound by hand, and how tightly they were wound, with how many coils of wire, could vary. How much the worker making pickups on any given day was looking forward to their lunch break could make a real difference in sound from pickup to pickup. Long story short, the pickup from my 1950’s Gibson ES 140 wound up fitting into my 175 with no alterations required, and it now sounds MUCH better! It still suffers from the lack of sustain that bothers you in yours, and the midrange-y attack thing, but it sounds so much fuller now and the increased gain gave me just the amount of sustain I needed for my more traditional style. So I’m a fan of pickup modifications when you love the playability and overall character of a guitar, even in a special vintage instrument like this. I feel like my guitar, if it could talk, would tell me “James, I’d rather be played every day than be a perfect museum piece.”
Oh, and the only comment I have to add that you didn’t already touch on is just this: the simplicity of a single pickup guitar is a joy! I realized a creative clarity in my playing almost as soon as I picked up this guitar because suddenly I didn’t need to fool around with mixing two volume levels and the tone knobs of two different pickups. It was the elimination of what had been a big distraction with my first student jazz hollow body (4 knobs and a pickup selector are a lot of controls to deal with when you are just learning your scales and arpeggios). “Graduating” to a single pickup guitar invited me to control my tone with my own hands on the strings in a way that I believe made me more connected to what I was playing.
Thanks for telling us the story of your beautiful ES-175. Happy New Years!
Hi Jens lack of sustain is caused by lack of gain from P90 pickups. Simply add a boss G7 Graphic pedal and you will fix all problems. Also stand closer to your amp to get the guitar to inter react with your amp.
Compressor pedal bro, I got an Epiphone ES 175 with 2 dog ear p90s in it, I think it was modified I got it used, I dont even really play jazz but I find it pretty fun once in a while, neck is almost as thick as my Gibson Les Paul Traditional too which has a 50's thick neck that I love. But yeah, you want sustain without squeeling and whatnot, play with a compressor or two and a noisegate or two.
Yeah, you can solve it like that but you have to hand in all your dynamics while playing which I find really difficult 🙂
Technically the craftsman ship and the electronics have certainly improved. But i did love the sound from the ES175 (i guess its the player not the guitar :-) ) .. also the latest L5-CeS is simply stupendous. Two Humbuckers as u know. Nice vide Jens.
I have a 1947 Gibson ES150, all original, and she often asks me why I don't play her more often these days (I can hear her from inside her case). The explanation I give is that i've been temporarily kidnapped by my ukulele but it doesn't carry much weight and she has a way of making me feel very guilty. She is after all beautiful in every sense of the word, a joy to play, and if I ever contemplated selling her, I know she would skin me alive!
I currently use a Carvin telecaster strung up with flatwounds-I was recently told by one of my professors at music school that I should swap to a semi-hollow or hollow body guitar when playing for the big band or combos. Feels a bit sad to me but I guess I could give it a shot
I like the 175 sound, not so much the 'thunk' but the organic depth of it as opposed to a pickup on a stick that solid bodies have. side note: I have been casually shopping for a 1953 ES175 because I was born in 53 so it's good to hear all about this guitar.
It is difficult to put words to these things, I wonder what organic depth is in terms of sound? I guess it is similar to the time I tried to compare a semi-hollow to a solid-body. They were super hard to tell apart.
@@JensLarsen i agree with timothy and i know what he means by "organic depth" ;) your just a dyed-inthe-wool Scofield guy, jens!
@@jeremyversusjazz Ok, so what does that mean then? "organic depth" I have to admit that I am leaning towards describing it as "how it sounds if I am looking at an old guitar" 🙂
@@JensLarsen ha! yeah it’s probably that kind of knee jerk reaction to vintage guitars… let’s put it this way every now and again I think people just want to hear the pure sound of an old arch top with an old pick up whether it’s a P90 or a DeArmond going through a clean amp or a very slightly broken up tweed amp just to hear that kind of blue note Kenny Burrell sound. but that doesn’t mean I don’t want to hear the modern sounds either. I watched a rotem slivan video a while back where he was playing with a very pure Jazz guitar tone, and it really jumped out from the rest of his videos that are super process sounding as far as the guitar tone.
it’s just nice sometimes.
@@JensLarsen what I meant by organic depth is the complexity of sound one gets from a vibrating wooden sound box as opposed to the sound of just vibrating strings. one could argue that the pickup nullifies the effect of the soundbox but I believe it is a subtle form of feedback to the vibrating string which is then transfered to the pickup.
Interesting story man! Guitars has such a great history behind them!
Thanks Ron!
@@JensLarsen I assume the previous owner had insurance on the stolen guitar therefore he didn't want it back. Its not an inexpensive guitar at this point.
Changing out the bridge top piece to a Tuneomatic improves sustain and smoothens out thunk. This should drop right on. P-90`s translate the acoustic properties of these guitar designs better than buckers. Happy New Year.
I have an ES 175 D from 1996, which plays like a dream - a beautiful thick and warm tone that I couldn't get from my tele. I also have an ES 137, which is a great sounding semi-hollow with no feedback issues. I think in the end you need to play what works for you. 90+% of the audience can't actually tell the difference! Obviously you can tell the difference in tone in the studio.
My ES 175 has humbuckers and I must say it took me 10 years to set the distance from strings to get the sweet tone.
My tone is always on 10.
Volume max 6
Played in Deluxe Reverb.
Killer jazz tone, and I like it percussive but it has sustain too.
Timely video as i just bought an epiphone casino for $500 with P90s. The 335 version with humbuckers- have to turn down the treble to get the tone and then it sounds muddy! The P90s sounded better balanced. But now I'll have to relisten. I had an ES 175 as my first guitar for 30 years. Had the same issues you talk about and always had feedback. I have a Yamaha silent guitar fitted with a Kent Armstrong jazz pickup that actually sounds amazing. This guitar is essentially a stick! So a lot is in the pick up. BUT the guitar i am truly searching for is the one that makes me play better !!! Maybe for xmas???? Thanks for all your vids. I'm not the same player i was much due to your lessons.
Hi Jens. I frequently modify my guitars and I think non-destructive modifications like a pickup change and/or an arch top bridge which features a modern steel tuneomatic would definitely add a more modern flavour.
@@Jens_Larsen. nice. How do I claim?
These big jazz boxes were designed for chording to support a big band and not for soloing. Replace the bridge with a metal or bone saddle and you'll get more sustain.
I had both an Epiphone ES 175 reissue and an Eastman arch top, they both had feedback issues that I resolved with Dougs Plugs (now out of business I believe). Ended up getting rid of them and using an Ibanez Artcore AS93. I only had the tone controls replaced so it would have a better tonal range. I’m in good company it appears
Nice! :)
Ha, thunk. I didn't know there was a name for that percussive pick attack. For a while I was trying desperately to get thunk out of my Parker Fly. To me it's the quintessential element of jazz guitar sound. But I can also see it becoming old if you hear it all the time .
I agree with you completely on turning down the tone knob for jazz. It’s not the way to go in my opinion.
A suggestion for the students out there: since guitars are so freaking expensive nowadays, a good compressor pedal evens out attack and bumps up sustain, and in general just makes guitars sound "better," clean or dirty, chords or notes. For my money, the best budget clean tone hack is a compressor, get you one and sound 12.45% more pro instantly ;). I can highly recommend the Keeley Compressor plus pedal and FMR RNC (it's a studio unit, but small enough to gig with). Both are available under $200, the Keeley can be found for ~$100 used all day, and it can take batteries. Both are very transparent, yet the dynamic shaping is powerful. I personally sold my much more valuable EH Blackfinger, gig with the Keeley, and just leave it on all the time. I don't know how prevalent outboard compressors are amongst jazzers, but it's an incredibly important effect that isn't all that widely understood by non-sound-guy types. Obviously if you can get the perfect guitar for your taste, that's the way to go, but even still, that guitar will be compressed at some point in any commercial recording. It behooves any musician to learn what compression does and how to use it, barring that, there's also the method of twiddling the knobs until it sounds good.
I always "thunk" that sustain was the holy grail of guitar playing. I agree with you Jens, thunk or clunk ?
Thank you, Ken 😂
Early jazz guys definitely had some brightness in their sound. Check out Barry Galbraith's "Nina Never Knew" from his album "Guitar and the Wind". Beautiful sound. Seems like some guys turned down the tone but not all. Listening to Jim Hall's Stella By Starlight recording - definitely a thunky sound. Not much sustain there and a lot of attack. It's cool but I seem to like a bit more than that. Mundell Lowe's guitar moods seems to have pretty beautiful sustain. Lots of good sounds in the paradigm and I can't ever decide what I like most!
Thanks for that, Jens. I had to sell my early 70s 175 a decade ago and wound up replacing it with a Heritage 575 I like better. The P90 characteristics you describe would bother me, also as a solo player.
I wish you a brave New Year !
Absolutely agree: most recorded jazz guitar tones (of good players at least) have quite a bit of treble, so just dialing back "tone" or treble on the amp won't give anyone a usable jazz guitar sound.