HOW BLEED BY MESHUGGAH CHANGED THE WAY I PLAY FOREVER
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- čas přidán 14. 10. 2018
- #meshuggah #guitarlesson
Want to learn music theory for metal?
This video is about how Bleed by Meshuggah changed the way I play forever.
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/ staymetalray
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What's the intro song bro?Thanks.
Hey man that’s a song I wrote it’s on my ep called starlit cavern. The song is called resurgence. The link is in the bio
czcams.com/video/VM0MhMjmD7U/video.html
@@xanderraymondcharles love that riff! 🤘
Thanks man!
Hear strong Keith Merrow influence in it
Funny thing is I was introduced to Meshuggah by a 90 yr old man. I was young and apparently stuff like that was too extreme for me but not a 90 yr old man. He loved it. Lol. I had to work my way up to it coming from Metallica and Megadeth.
That is actually awesome.
thats badass
🧢
Megadeth is my favorite band
I started with Metallica also haha
Man, thank you so much! I also suffered from the same fatigue like you described and was like: "What on earth am I doing wrong?" Very helpful! Thank you =)
With every video I find about Bleed, the mechanics of the song keep getting more and more complex. Now it's gotten to the point where even holding the pick makes a difference.
Video starts at 1:25
The abundance of "0's" in this vid is astonishing
You mean 5s?
"00000000000" is great because it serves both as tabs and lyrics.
Bleed is one of my favorite songs man! The Wincent-Thomas Haake drum video came through my feed and I was hooked. I watched the video interview with Thomas and he said that it almost didn't make it on the album because it took him 6 months to learn the drums for it. The song took on a special meaning to me last November because my Mother had a brain bleed and I had never seen her in so much pain before. The lyrics became painfully clear. Unfortunately, she passed away In surgery the next day. So, bleed has a special meaning to me now. Not to get too morose but just wanted to share. Great video. Been enjoying your stuff. Keep it up.
Oh wow I've been playing metal rhythm for 20+ years and was trying to play this song for few months now, and got so frustrated with the same problem.. im so glad i found this video coz i never thought changing the way i pick can make such huge difference!! It literally changes everything. Thank you for this video and sharing the experince openly!
I had the exact problem but I fixed it with a different solution. Just like you, I had sprained my index finger and I couldn't play for a few months. Your solution was to use your other fingers to support your pointer finger. My solution was to relax my hand. I basically had to rewire my brain to relax my grip when I play faster. The faster I picked, the more relaxed my grip would get. It was sooooo hard at first. It felt so natural to grip harder the faster I got. Now I had to do the opposite of what felt natural. I saw a video of Guthrie Govan talking about 32nd note strumming and he said that he can only do it while being super loose so I taught myself the same technique. Eventually I got used to it and now I can pick fast with no pain. I think it actually made me faster too. Its cool to see someone have a similar journey.
Indeed. To be honest, it seemed to me as if it's really the same thing except you're not closing it into a fist form but keeping it as a loose support?
or I understood it wrong? You can indeed keep the grip a lot more relaxed since there's a big physical barrier holding it in place
I play the same way. I can't play fast unless my hand is good and relaxed. I had the same problem. I would hold the pick harder as I sped up. When I learned to relax my hand, my playing improved a lot, especially my sweeps.
Only thing there is it might make the tone a little less aggressive, you'll be hitting the strings a lot more gently. It's not wrong, I just don't know which way it's actually done
i had the same problem learning bleed, my solution was to just pummel through it without changing a thing and eventually building the gains whereby theres no stress anymore on the index joint lol jk i probably just relaxed the thumb side of the pick.. i guess
Your new way of holding a pick is my way of holding a pick since the first day I learned guitar with pick.
It's amazing how people randomly have their own style of holding a pick. People's finger just have a tendency of how they hold the pick.
bayu mantari same here man. That’s how i started picking. But it’s really cool like u said. Different types of styles and what not!:)
Same but I saw someone online playing like that before I even got a guitar so I deferred to that. Don’t really know anyone who holds the pick with their index uncurled
Bad Word James hetfield holds the pick like a potato chip with three fingers
Dylan Doe that scares me
I've been playing that way since I began over 30 years ago and I never knew there was another way. The only difference is I keep my lower three fingers extended outwards instead of like a fist but they're all supporting my index finger unless I'm trying to play gently. I'm gonna try closing my fist when I play to see what changes.
How many times does he say "Bleed by Meshuggah"?
If we was playing a drinking game we would all have alcohol poisoning..
Cool video! This is something I’ve been struggling with. Thanks for the advice!
Dude. Im left handed and play right hand guitar, and picking that fast has always been a struggle--my left hand runs circles around my right hand, even after 16 years of playing. I came across this video and literally not ONCE in my entire life have i ever even considered how i was holding my pick. I switched to the grip you showed and immediately i was picking faster and more accurately. Damn man im so glad i came across this video lol
Thank you! This was a lifesaver for me!!!:D I came across this tip a few times in the past, but never actually gave attention to it until now. Thank you!
I tried this out and now I can play wonderwall
I played with my fist like that since I started playing guitar and everyone kept telling me it's wrong and that I look tense so I had to learn how to play with two fingers. I guess I'm going back to playing with a closed fist again lmao.
Dude im 15 and this video already changed my life thank you so much for sharing this with everyone
Nice story :) I am not into this kind of metal yet, but I recently changed my picking technique in a way a bit similar to yours, and I was impressed at how I am now more in control, with less fatigue!
Dammmnnnn man. I just watched this video like 10 minutes ago because just like you I’ve been playing it “okay” style, tried it immediately after watching with “fist” style picking and literally nailed the rhythm. You are so awesome dude so glad you made this video
Hell yeah zach! So glad you’re able to get it down!
I can't explain how much you helped me! I could not use pick for the life of me. I can play all the songs I know except the finger style!! This has changed my way of life man!
Thank you so much for your comment. This means so much to me knowing I helped someone get better!
@@xanderraymondcharles seriously though you changed my playing forever! I have a 8 string on the way! When i get it would you like to see my progress? I wanna make CZcams videos aswell but they don't get traction yet.
@@xanderraymondcharles I already have a video up showing my progress lol
Dude!!! Way helpful!! Ive been struggling with the same problem. This makes total sense! Thanks bro!
Wheres a good site for the tabs as well?
Hey mike thanks so much for checking out the video. My website musictheoryformetal.com helps explain in more detail, and offers lessons with different examples and tunings. Thanks again!
Man this just helped me out so much!! Thank you!
“Back in the day, maybe like 18 months ago”... Exactly something I would say haha. This is a great demonstration/story telling video, and information like this is much needed for up and coming guitarists who want to get serious about their chops! Awesome work, you have a new subscriber my friend. 🙂
Hey Ian I really appreciate the support. I'm also glad you get my dry sense of humor "18 months ago" some people really got mad at that joke haha glad you can appreciate it. Cheers my dude
Stay Metal Ray Haha people get feisty about anything nowadays! Do you have a band/studio project to follow?
Dud you have no idea. People get crazy on here haha.
Yessir I've got a studio project called Luna Muerta. It's the intro song to all my videos. The link is here: czcams.com/video/VM0MhMjmD7U/video.html
Thanks for your support again man
This video helped me a lot!
Great advice!!! Very true. I stumbled on this technique myself while riffing, and it really works.
Wow! Seriously it changes a lot! Thanks ;-)
I assume you’ve never touched those higher strings
WAIT THOSE THINGS ARE STRINGS?! I ONLY THOUGHT THIS GUITAR HAD TWO STRINGS. MAN THIANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS EYE OPENING COMMENT
I bet Ive never touched the frets
What’s a meshuggah
I bet you use only plugins and never use a real amp
@@vamp2709 Wow, the hate is unnecessary. This guy had the fucking balls to put a video up while you're here being a Keyboard Warrior. You're bringing shame to real Metal and Suicidal fans.
Go home troll...
Love this THANKS MAN
this is amazing, thank you
This was very helpful thank you so much!
I learned to hold the pick from a video as well. It was a lesson by dave mustaine and he was holding the pick so just the bare minimum of the tip was visible.
I thought "ok, that seems to be a great way to have more control and to play cleaner and faster. I should try this."
So I did years ago.
Still do.
Holding it exactly the same way as you do. Palm mutes are also so much more comfortable like that. Can't even remember how to palm mute any other way that doesn't looks like it would hurt after 10 minutes.
Look at the picking technique videos of those metal legends. It's really interesting and can make a huge step up on the playing. There are tons of interesting stuff in that term, including an analysis of the picking technique of Michael Angelo Batio, that makes shredding faster and more economical.
Hey, brother... great video! I'm definitely gonna start working on this technique. I've noticed that Jason Richardson seems to play with a similar picking technique, as well, and he talked about it when he was on with the Captain (Anderton's Music CO) last week. Thank you for your service, my friend!
Thanks so much Dave!
My problem after learning Bleed is that I accidentally add triplets to more or less everything.
Those are hertas, not triplets
@@notoriusdrifter40 no herta on guitar
@@Dylan_matkowsky how? Hertas are 2 16th notes with an 8th note behind, and those are hertas. Triplets are fitting two more notes in a bar. If you have quarter notes, you have 4 notes in a bar, triplets are 6 quarter notes in a bar. Learn your shit
Thats awesome bro! *FIST bump* \m/
Thanks Matt!
This is really true!! The fist really helps in playing effortlessly. I can relate bro!
After my index finger hurt from gripping the pick to hard, and I had to pause playing for weeks, I also changed the way I hold my pick a few years ago. Before I held the pick with a more open hand and also ankered with the pinky on the guitar body below the highest string. I now support the index finger with the other fingers like you've illustrated. This a really valuable advice and I try to suggest it to other players when I can. Thank you for the video!
This is great!
As a fellow guitarist always trying to learn new techniques to utilize in my own writing. Thank you for explaining this the way that you did.
I've tried this method as it seems every other guitarist holds their pick in the fist method.
However, every time I try it, my fingers scrape along the strings, making palm muting and picking in general painful. Any advice?
I know exactly what your talking about man. I had the same scenario happen when I spent days trying to perfect The Escapist notion by the haarp machine, (the very first playthrough) I eventually got it down, but it changed my playing style, forever!!
Hey what's up James? Thats crazy you had a smilier thing happen. it's pretty cool how certain songs makes us better players
nice advice man. thanks!
I love the people with out content leaving hate. Much love dude
Thank you, finally 🤘🤘
Im gonna learn it now thanks a lot for the motivation through this video ( testimony )
Nice tip, thanks for sharing!
Thanks for checking it out Lewis!
cool story on improving your technique bro!
I went thru a very similar progression with the ok pick grip vs the fist style grip.
Was doing the a ok grip for like 10 years...
One day i was really thinking about what was holding back my playing the most, and realized a lot of it was technique issues.
Part of my issues were too much strain in my picking hand, too much force put down on the neck with my fretting hand, and improper pick holding and pick strumming angles.
Troy Grady ended up explaining what I had discovered about my playing not long after with cracking the code!
Awesome!! 🤘🤘
Man not sure if you still get notifications for this vid but it honestly changed everything picking for me, couldn't be more grateful!
Yessir I am! Thank you Sean! I hope it helps you get this riff down! 🤘🏼
Honestly if I had an 8 string I would totally be at it, I'm mainly a bass player but even still it changed pick wise
This is the way I have always naturally played. Its honestly difficult for me to play with the "OK sign". Everytime I try playing that way, my fingers naturally curl. Your totally right too when it comes to fatigue and having more strength with your picking hand. Alot more attack in your playing.
Since watching this vid like 2 years ago, I’ve been holding my pick like this. I started playing 3 years back and this helped me add consistency and speed to my playing.
Lemme tell you a song that's hard on a new level. Dancers to a discordant system by meshuggah. The patterns in that song are all over the place
Dude right?! I’ve gotten the two intro riffs down and part of the verse and then I’m all fucked up hahah. It’s not hard to play just hard to memorize. It’s like simon says with the kick drum for 9 mins straight
I just recently memorized the Dancers riff "Confined, bereft of reason..." after trying on and off for a year. What made it click was looking at the different "layers" of the riff as individual parts (so what is the first of each six notes doing, what is the last of each six notes doing, what is the 3rd string doing, etc). That's where the patterns start to emerge. Great video btw
The riff is basically the same, but its displaced one 8th note triplet. listen to any of their stuff and you'll see its this same pattern.
Amazing cover czcams.com/video/MyckFsxeylE/video.html
Yes! I have also noticed that in my hands in very high-speed alternate picking. Thanks for the tip.
Great video bro!
I got one question: I have the Ibanez M80M and I'm really thinking about getting your Strandberg. Do you think it's worth exchanging them?!?
strand berg's stuff is next level I highly recommend it
@@xanderraymondcharles Thanks for your answer bro! Hope you'll see it in one my videos soon.
The only thing I would be concerned with is the neck difference. Strandberg's necks are different. Most people either love or hate them.
@@Bierce88 Yeah, but they seem actually really ergonomic. I wish I can try one.
Nah, the m80m is the best sounding 8 string on the market
This legitimately just helped me play Bleed better
That’s what I like to hear! Glad to help you out
How well does your technique work standing? When i try it standing my middle, ring, and pinky knuckles are all rubbing on the strings
Very observant you are fellow axe brother! I noticed Al DiMeola's right hand employs a similar technique on his Ovation acoustic days, the attack and speed! The "fist" technique is about balance either by wrist or elbow as fulcrum. You made me try it for these classic Meshuggah riffs. Thanks dude.
Thanks man!
Late to the game on this video. Thank you so much. I come from the George Lynch school of the OK symbol picking style. I have an 8-string Meshuggah Ibanez on order. The "fist" pick hold is going into my arsenal and going to be practiced religiously. Thanks so much Ray!
Do you find it better for normal down picking too, like just creeping death by metallica or something? Because I can play it playing but I get tired and sloppy sometimes
I play a 7 string esp ... Thats how I have played for years ... I use this similar method ... So more versital when making those ... My riiffing got way more intense and was able to come up with alot more material ... Glad I found this channel ... Thanks man keep on jamming
Ayo , i haven't tried this technique yet , planning to wait for my first ever 7 and 8 string to arrive that i just ordered couple days ago , ( 7 string Jackson and 8 string Ibanez 😊 so hyped to try both of these for the first time) i don't got a pick in my hand at the moment, but even then i feel like im noticing a difference in hand motion strength trying to move my hand to the rhythm, you may have just found the secret code that alot of people should be talking about lol. Gonna sub just for that extra tidbit. Bought these 2 guitars cause I've been wanting to get into the heavier stuff for experimenting lol bleed by Meshuggah is one of the daunting challenges I plan to put on myself. Fingers crossed in the next couple months that i can keep up with some of the song
this is helpful!
Thanks for that man, makes life a whole lot easier for me! Off topic: How would you describe the difference between this year's SLS Elite Evil Twin and the ´18 Latte Macchiato one, is there any difference at all? I'm definitely going for a Schecter as my next guitar, but its hard for me to test one here
Thx for the info
Only if this worked on drums
:'(
learn the bass drum pattern on your hands before even attempting the feet. all of it is part of the 16th note grid. feel the pulse man, it's groovy af. once attempting it with the feet, lean back. don't put a ton of pressure on the pedals. Tomas Haake (Meshuggah's drummer) himself said he had to practice JUST the bass drum pattern for 6 months before it fell into place with the rest of the band. I've been going at it for a couple months myself, and it really is an extremely challenging song to keep that groove going. Meshuggah really are masters of groove, especially Haake.
@@itssk1092 Yep. There are only 8 eight-bar patterns in the song - it's not that hard. Basically it's one big musical etude.
thx so much I'll try it straight away when coming back home! been a while im trying to play this insane song...
Hey man good luck! It just takes patience
thx Ray! indeed patience is needed when learning Meshugga's songs, I think it took me about 2 weeks (more or less one hour per day) to be able to play the first and amazing riff from "in death is life" without a glitch! (though that one is more about learning the pattern than anything technique) I will work on bleed using the right wrist technique and slowly with a metronome.
Cool Man, I am going to try this know as I have the same problem with index finger pain.
It would good to list all players that have this style. There are a lot of big names that do use this style, especially in Metal.(Perhaps a follow up video idea?)
Wow, thanks for the tip on Picking it works for real!!!!!!!!!!!You are the Man Ray!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This has really helped.
It's true my picking also changed lol.i have to walk my picking fingers back in forth to get the timing right .
Thanks Ray I will be giving this a go👍
anytime I hope it helps!
the same thing happened to me , and i find it by myself xD i was remembering the down picking of hetfield , and now i saw your video i am happy i am on the righ path 🙂 thank you
thanks, I'll try it soon
I want start playing 8 string guitar , first what pick you recomend?
I’m back at this song again. My goal is to play it all the way through to a metronome only while tapping my foot in 4/4 with the metronome. It’s super hard right now. I don’t understand why the bends are where they are. I’m just gonna play to the track first and then go to metronome only from there I guess. Any thoughts?
I tried playing it in guitar center, I didn't even play it correctly, and I was still aching From that chugging.
It changed your playing by needing wrist surgery since your muscles are broken.
it changed my playing because my arm literally fell off
lolololololololol
Great video! I think relaxing your picking hand is one of the biggest technical hurdles to overcome as a guitarist. There's a lot that isn't really intuitive about picking. People quite often begin guitar, get a teacher who tells them to simply do what "feels natural", and that will inform their approach to developing technique for many years, perhaps even their whole life.
While this IS good advice, it also promotes a wishy-washy approach to some aspects of technique development. I've always tucked my other picking-hand fingers, but my picking hand developed a habit of really favoring my thumb and index to move the pick also. In some cases, this is beneficial: I can string-skip cleanly, and alternate pick arpeggios at moderate to fast speeds because jumping over the string feels "natural" to me. But, like many other people, I realized this was a very bad habit when trying to tremolo pick as your fingers flapping around quickly trick you into thinking that your picking hand is working harder than it is, and a lot of wrist-muscles are being under-utilized. So in spite of feeling "natural", it developed a motion that was ergonomically impossible to tremolo pick quickly with. Don't let feeling natural prevent you from trying to solve problems with your playing!
I've been banging away on bleed not picking up nearly enough speed, but having fun anyways. Your hand movement looked odd to me as I strictly alt pick my gallops meaning i go down up down for the gallop and then down for the 4th note then down up down on the next gallop. Feels natural to me playing sooo many metallica songs having all those downs.
Are you economy picking it? going down up down (gallop) then up then down up down(gallop)?
Hope this makes sense, lol.
I can totally relate to this!! I actually changed the way I pick because the same thing happened to me the first time I went to a recording studio, and the producer taught me the exact same technique! And although it helped me a lot to have more grip and attack in my playing, the ultimate goal is to relax as much as you can (which is a hard thing to teach your brain)...if I knew that before I didn't get a tendinitis near my shoulder which is a real pain in the ass!
I'm late ,but what plugin are u using?
This is so odd to me I've been playing since 16 (27 now) and I had this exact realization today as I was jamming about, just finding it hard to change technique as I've picked the sloppy way so many years and tips to getting more comfortable with this?! Thanks Ray!
Interesting, I’m going to try it
For anyone who try to learn this song this is a very good tip to change your picking hand into a fist. I usually play like hetfield with 2 finger grip but changed it only for this song and it works.
I was having really tense forearm and wrist fatigue. so I was playing around with different positions, and this was actually my end result. good to know I'm not the only one that's doing it!
Great points made, Ray; the pick position, its palm placement, and grip have got to be the most overlooked concepts of learning how to play the guitar (no matter how many strings, or genre). Your comments echo what Jason Richardson remarked during the winter NAMM 2018 during his interview - most people hold the pick wrong and expose themselves to huge fatigue-related & performance problems. If you haven’t done it already, check out the Cracking the Code series by Troy Grady - insanely good stuff - Troy has devoted his career to cracking the ultimate question, the understanding of how to hold & play with the darn thing :) Cheers!
How is your guittar equip equalization?i like the sound
Do you adjust to play harmonics? And how are arpeggios? It’s a lot easier to speed pick like that, but I could never get in the habit of using it throughout the rest of my playing. Just isn’t comfortable, and adjusting every time just isn’t efficient.
Yeah I use this technique for everything. Solos sweep picking pinch harmonics etc.
Have you tried to play Fear Factory? Is this how Dino Plays too? Ive been trying to play some Fear Factory for a long time and the tempo kills my wrist. I gave up and hardly ever pick up the 7 string guitar. Thanks a lot for posting this. I’m gonna give it a shot when I get home.
I have the same guitar . I subscribed because of it lol. Also thanks for the lesson . I am trying to play it but I get stuck .
This is the first thing my guitare teacher learn me, it was a game changer for me too, no more tension, relax playing. And to do an analogy, there is a lot of probability that Kirk hammett sometimes wrap his right hand fingers to add more weigh to his strokes like the close fist :)
Awesome advice thank you
You’re welcome! I hope it helps!
Yeah, I always got worn out learning Metallica MOP songs (and a bit of Bleed, as well) and figured it just wasn't for me, either. I had been messing around with different picks, working on different angles to hold them for leads, etc. and came upon something close to the closed-fist approach you're using, with the other fingers curled up though behind the first finger still holding the pick the same as I always had, and it definitely has helped with thrash picking and even some lead work, though I think alternating to the traditional picking way helps me with some patterns. I'll definitely have to give your specific approach a try. It can be very enlightening to have been playing for decades and suddenly come upon something that changes a basic approach to playing that can still make a very positive difference. I'm glad you found that and it's working so well for you. 8)
I've been using this picking technique for a really long time. I can't remember who I first heard it from, perhaps Mick Thompson or John Petrucci, but it was a serious game changer for me. The hardest part about bleed for me, other than the fact I don't own an 8 string, is the picking pattern. A triplet of down, up, down, followed by an upstroke. For years I tried to use down, up, down, down, like a traditional gallop, but it's too fatiguing. I only recently learned about how that song uses economy picking. Anyway, great video man, love the Strandberg! Looking at getting one myself.
Is it still easy to do pinch harmonics? I should try this new technique
This video was very interesting for me in a way you probably wouldnt expect. As Fredrik is one of my favorite guitarist I watched a lot of his playing and once I picked up guitar myself I instantly just held the pick like he was. So I never really experienced the fatigue that you are talking about . But nonetheless, very interesting.
I feel like a song like that changes your playing no matter what. I already had the pick grip down, though I typically extend my bottom three fingers out in case I need to hybrid pick (not for this song obviously), but it really drew attention to how much I have a tendency to tighten my wrist when playing faster stuff. Might work for shorter bursts of speed, but when you keep that up for 7 minutes, it’s just not possible
great video, you won a sub! :)
Thank you Luis!
As an intermidiate guitar player I've been playing with a closed palm for around a year now and I love it, its way more comfortable to play but to this day I find my pinky finger's tendens getting really tired from streching when I play a lot of hours in a week.
Well, Bleed brought me here too. Could you elaborate on how you made the change from your old style to the new? I get the basic idea, but I'm struggling with the song still, I guess others are also. Thanks!
Ive been catching myself playing im that new style u do with the fist for the path three months and havent went back either sometimes i try and pull myself out of it but it feels so much better
I'm gonna try holding my pick like this now. I can see how it would work for heavy rhythm riffs, but unsure of it's effectiveness in shit like alternate picking, pinch harmonics, etc. Curious to see if there's an easy way to smoothly transition between pick holding methods mid song.
You will probably find that it does nothing for any of the above.