Honda S500 / S600 / S800: the highest-revving sports car | Revelations with Jason Cammisa | Ep. 04
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- čas přidán 3. 03. 2021
- It's hard to imagine a world without Honda and Lamborghini, but they both first started making cars in the early 1960s.
Honda's first-ever passenger car (its first "car" was actually the T360 "truck") was first shown in 1962 as the Sports 360 and Sports 500 prototypes with 356- and 492-cc four-cylinders.
The S500 made it to production a year or so later with a slightly larger 531-cc four, which was eventually supplemented by the 606-cc S600 and the 791-cc S800.
The aluminum engine was the highlight of this tiny roadster (and coupe), with DOHC, hemispherical combustion chambers, and a roller-bearing crankshaft. Its design allowed it to rev to the moon - up to 9500 rpm in the case of the S600 - a redline that no other production passenger-car engine has beat even today.
The car itself was a marvel of simplicity and elegant engineering, with chain-drive independent suspension (later replaced by a conventional solid axle), a 4- or 5-speed synchronized transmission, rack-and-pinion steering, and (later) front-wheel disc brakes.
It was also available in red and white - two colors previously illegal in Japan, as they were reserved for police and emergency vehicles. Soichiro Honda fought the government on this - and won. This is one of many of his victories against the Man, and the Honda Sports series was one of his many victories against the challenges of engineering a car.
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I'm a simple man, I see discount Adam Sandler I click like.
😀
😅😅😅
7:47 spitting image
Lmaoooo
Adam Sandler is discount Jason Cammisa.
Hagerty is killing the CZcams car game right now
Cammisa makes the diference...
Yea this was excellent video, hands down.
You mean JASON CAMMISA
These Videos are great! The viewcount, compared to what gets millions of views, makes me want to cry...
Yes
Jason Cammisa has a way of being hilarious without being annoying, entertaining without feeling gimmicky, and he has a way of dropping serious knowledge without being condescending or self-important. Kudos, hermano. These "Revelations" videos are something too few car videos are. They're WATCHABLE.
That engine note at the end was heavenly.
God the engine the expressed itself beautifully
oh yes, it kinda sounds like a motorcycle.
Back in the 60s the S600 engine had been dyno-ed somewhere in Austria and managed to go over 12 000 RPM before the dyno had broken down, engine survived without a scratch.
Their first car(s) had ROLLER BEARING CRANKSHAFTS!!! That’s amazing F1 tech that companies today don’t even do. Those engines are masterpieces like a Patek watch. Any collection with a 6 or 800 is a lucky collection.
That was in Braunschweig, Germany.
@@alexmartinez280 its not done cuz its not really necessary. oil works fine and bearings have to be replaced at one point and add unnecessary weight
new meaning of OVER BUILT
Coz it's a Honda...
As an S2000 owner/enthusiast, this makes me appreciate the history of my car even more
Still in love with my S2000 after all these years!
I salute you gentleman
I think I would literally be angry at any S2000 owner who wasn't also an enthusiast. Never encountered one though. At least not since they were new. Friend of my dad's bought one when they first came out, complained that the engine "sounds like a bag of spanners" and sold it and bought an automatic Z3 with the largest straight 6 he could find. Old British guy who grew up wanting an Austin Healey I guess. I like to think an enthusiast enjoyed bought the car and enjoyed the depreciation the first owner swallowed.
@@throwback19841 That's hilarious. The poor guy didn't know what he had!
@@alexliaao Well, he's dead now, as is my Dad, so from his point of view, he got what he wanted there and then. Wouldn't do him any good now. So if you ever wonder why some people have lots of money and just eat the depreciation... its because they have more money than time. They also make great people to buy cars from - think carfaxes with a complete, on time dealer service history. They eat the depreciation, we enjoy the car.
I actually owned a 1964 S600 for about 10 years. It was the most beautiful car to drive and I regret ever having to part company with it
What do you think it world be valued at today?
@@PeterAlanA1234567890 between 19k and 72k USD, depending on age, condition, mileage, and how original it is. Average is around $35k. They're shockingly uncommon to find on the open market despite their comparatively manageable purchase price, so if you want one then you'll have to haunt some auction sites to find them. Part of the problem is that this was before electrochemical plating baths were used to add a rust preventative coating to the body prior to primer and paint, so they tend to rust away fairly easily if the undercoating and paint isn't maintained well.
I have owned an S800 coupe for the last 30 odd years. I always knew it to be a very special car. Watching your post was so enlightening how amazing this car is. Thank you so much.
big envy... enjoy it sir (the car, not the envy)
"Happiness is on the other side of 7,000 RPM"- James Engelsman from Throttle House.
I do remember that.
So all of kei cars
Me realizing my v8 redlines at 5k rpm. "Guess no joy for me"
I think he said 8000 RPM
The pure music coming from the throttle bodies is almost making me cry, and that's coming from a muscle car guy
Makes me miss my '71 VW Type3 with dual, dual-throat Webers. Such a unique sound today.
Waited all video for that in cockpit sound - intoxicating between the slightly buzzy exhaust note and the induction noises
Sadly soon there will only be EVs
Love it…
The fact the video shows them actually taking it all the way to 9k before shifting….
Unlike other videos where they just talk about it
This car has one of those rare engines that hits its power limited red line 2000 rpm below the actual destructive red line of the engine. I agree, its was nice to see the red line on those shifts.
I had always (mistakenly) thought these cars were front wheel drive. I also (mistakenly) thought they shared the drive train with the slightly later N600/N800 coupes. Nice to learn something new about a 60 year old car.
I remember around 1984 as a kid my neighbors got a brand new Honda Accord(sedan with the pop up lights). We had an Oldsmobile Cutlas Ciera sedan(not as cool but comfy and we had it for two decades and it never broke down). The Honda just felt super cool with the pop up lights we played with all the time and I recall just feeling like the car was built very well. A mysterious deep seated quality in just even how the buttons felt when pressed. A precise and luxurious CLICK it would delight your fingers. The doors felt like one piece of metal somehow and when slammed would just sound like a solid WHOOOOMP. When you started the car it also commanded confidence and personality with that precise Honda TWERK TICK starter sound. And then my other neighbors got a new Hyundai and it felt very wobbly like the door handles might fall off; we left that car alone. Ever since then I was in love with Honda and Japanese products that feel ultra and don’t let you down.
You have to be around my age , because I went through the exact same feeling lol Cutlas is a nice comfy car but like you said you could just feel the quality of a Honda, Hyundai was not that great lol
The iconic old Honda starter is unforgettable, I don't know of any other that sounds like it.
I have a feeling that one day I may end up with one of these. That looks like a lot of fun!
honestly, if you can find a good one, i am willing to buy it from you
Slower than a VW 🐛 bug
@@happyraccoon4791 With 70 HP in a 1400 pound car and short gearing, this car would certainly outdrag a bug.
@@jamesiverson209 And outhandle it by a mile. Anyone who's ever driven a swing axle VW hard knows what I mean.
@@jamesiverson209 I doubt the 800 made 70hp. My 1964 Triumph Spitfire weighs 1500 lbs and 70 hp, does a little better than a bug. And the Honda 600's, they were slow. These things might beat Steve Erkels BMW Iseta
If car companies managed to re-introduce cars like this, motorcycles might have a run for their money in the fun per cost value.
Blame US regulations- in UK you can easily put a kit car like this on the road. I'd give up my motorcycle for something like this (with more HP though) in a heartbeat.
@@future62 You can make a kit car in the US too. In Florida they would register a soap box derby car as good for the road.
@@RCXDerp that's Florida though
Driving a car will never be able to compete with riding a motorcycle, and vice versa. Two different experiences and I enjoy them both. (Honda's all around in my case.)
Honda builds the S660 right now (2021 model)
I bought a second hand S800 in the 1970s and it was probably the most exciting car I ever had. Great review!
An old colleague of my former work has 3 S800 roadsters including a rare factory race car S800. They are truely diminutive cars but so full of technologies that outshone so many other cars in the day. They are fun to drive in, oh and so collectible these days.
Jason is literally the next level car journalist 🤌🏼
🙏
Also Savagegeese
Really? His poorly executed cutesy act really ruins this for me. SG is much smarter and his humor is usually funny.
@@taylorc2542 Great that you find him funny, but you should fact-check one of SG's reviews. He's not a journalist and it's unacceptable that he gets so much wrong.
@@taylorc2542 Savagegeese is the real deal, but Jason is w close second.
It sounds like it's in a hurry, even if it's not. What a beautiful sound.
I just bought a Honda S2000 AP1... now I can appreciate where it all started from!!
As the owner of a jdm B16a, revving out to 8200 rpm makes me appreciate my Honda even more.
Same with my dad’s B16A3 Del Sol 👌🏼
@@johnbowden7058 The CR-X Del Sol is an unbelievable combination of futuristic design, driving experience changing roof and a magnificent out of the box engine.
B16 engines are bullet proof.
With great and honest application of engine advancements and zero product obsolescence these engines can be passed on many times over (still sealed from the factory) and many are even being passed from one generation to the other still sealed.
More than what can be said with engines today and a real wake up confirmation to the reality of product sabotage (planned obsolescence) to increase sales.
@@crxdelsolsir Yea man and it’s easily one of the best sounding Honda motors IMO. More so than my basic bolt-on K20A2 and my dad’s S2K. The RSX is similar, but feels more mechanical and refined. The Sol now has a 1320 UEL header and Medallion Cat-back, but even before when it was just running a short ram intake, it had this growl at low revs that sounded deeper than both of those cars and just straight BELLOWED at wide-open-throttle. Crazy how a little 1.6L can sound more aggressive than a 2.0L, though it might be because of the way Honda designed the intake manifold.
7:10 - nice cover. Pretending to be reaching for the door handle while in reality letting one rip. Very creative.
Lol. Not sure which is funnier - the fart, or you noticing it. Ahahahaha!
@@quartermilejunkie5439 hey man, any seasoned driver worth his salt is bound to become a connoisseur: a true petrolhead knows when one is coming. That’s how we are able to quickly roll the windows down or up, depending on the provenance.
Knowing Jason Cammisa I would not be surprised if he farted in purpose on camera...
@@kencur9690 Hmm..., it is a convertible so maybe you have a point - why else reach for the window, right? lol
It’s the leather seats I swear 😂
The driving footage at the end felt good. More of that, without the music
Man, that drive at the end put a smile on my face. To hear those revs under the speed limit on public roads, and that light steering wheel, I would so want to drive one of those!
The Japanese are underappreciated in the car world. This car is just as beautiful as anything from Italy in that time period. It sounds great too!
Then Datsun comes out with the Sports Roadsters just a few years later and ups the beauty and displacement over the Hondas.
and much reliable
10:11 Doug is the type of guy that won't sue you for copyright infringement.
THISSSS
🤣🤣
"Everything is so tiny" except for this GIANT YACHT SIZED STEERING WHEEL.
Yeah, I noticed that also. My Fiat had no power steering, so you need the leverage at low speeds. I'm guessing no powe steering in the Honda. You don't really need it. Just don't hit any potholes!!!
cars back then did not have giant in terms or thickness but had larger diameter because power assist was either non-existent or not very good. My Mustang had strong power steering but fairly large, thin wheel
Young people should get in one of these appreciate how dangerous cars were back then. Minor mistakes in this car would kill you. Sit in this car and realize how little protection you have.
@@jamesmedina2062 My Dad's 1961 Morgan has a 17" steering wheel. When I got the car I put in a 14" wheel, still drives fine.
@@taylorc2542 S600 has full ladder frame chassis and all welded seams body, very rigid car. It's 12' long and way safer than a Berkeley which you can easily lift and just as easily get run over in as it is way lower than an S600 ! No fears, young people can't afford an S600 these days not like in the '80s when the average sale price was $2500,
My S2000 origin story. I love mine even more now.
Is it also a origin story for a honda s660 neo classic
Hagerty & Jason, ref0:26 - The 1991 Honda Beat was the first open top sports car by Honda since production ceased on the S800 (not the S2000) & they are an absolute riot! Brilliant content, thank you.
I gotta say, I'm subscribed exclusively for Jason's content.
i agree completely
SAME.
Same indeed
So am I!
A big thank you to the owner of the S800 that made this possible for the folks at Hagerty. As a lifelong Honda fan, it's nice to see some of this company's creations enjoying a bit more time in the spotlight these days. These early S cars are so awesome. I was particularly happy to see this car being driven, like the sports car that it is, before this video came to an end.
I'm in love with this car. Probably the best sound ever heard. It seems alive
I drive a modded nb2 miata daily. The feeling the handling and the smile I get every time I drive will never be met by new car. And that's last 20 years.
Looking at the details of the s600 makes you realize how much Honda stuck to the original formula for the ap1 S2000. Heck, even the later model s800 with the lower 8k redline resembles the later model ap2 s2000 with the 8k redline. Genius!
only for the US market because people didn't value a high reving NA engine, rest of the world kept the 9k rpm
@@binskee677 Not quite. Japan eventually put the 2.2 in the 08/09 model years.
@@sdlausen1 ah yes right they did that at the end as they wanted to roll out the Type S version in Japan as well.
4:19 Honda wasn't making many 2 strokes in the 60s and 70s (only track bikes and the CR series dirt bikes) Soichiro prefered OHC 4 strokes for their engineering and efficiency
Spot on. Honda have never really been known for two strokes, now Kawasaki and Suzuki on the other hand :)
1983-98 CR 250 and 500 best MX bikes ever made.
These two strokes ruled.
@@phila3884 Honda C50? thats a horizontally mounted OHC 4 stroke
@@simonhudak3763 I see thanks.
@@MitzvosGolem1 My rommate in college had a 1981 CR250. It was terrifying for me to ride it coming off a 125!
As an S2000 owner for the last decade or so, this is the video I needed to find. What a NOISE! I would love to find one as a friend for my S2000. Love your videos Jason.
I have the b16A in my American spec 90 civic hatch back. The engine 1.6 twin cam Vtec that makes 160 hp and revs to 8500. The car is an absolute riot in the twisties and just keeps running after years of beating on it. Honda’s are my favorite cars, I’ve owned a bunch of them and they’ve all been fantastic.
The AP1 S2000 was such a perfect (30 years later) followup on that S800. Awesome...
Honda s660 neo classic is a thing
The AP1 is a honda NA6
Honda really is a great engine maker. Top of my list.
I will call that and raise you and call them the greatest car manufacturer. When you consider what you get for your money
@@jackhammer111 For that I'd tie them with Toyota. Only instead of motorcycles, Toyota also revolutionized the off-road segment
@@walmorcarvalho2512 What off-road segment? Are you talkin about the Land Cruiser? You might tell me Toyota still makes 4-wheel drive pickup trucks but nobody's buying them in the United States. Yes it's true Honda just not known for pickup trucks. But I can see Toyota is known for very high quality. But there's always been a style difference between Toyota and Honda. As a matter fact I don't see that many Toyota cars on the road anymore.
@@jackhammer111 IDK about the US but the Toyota SUVs and pick-up trucks are still in VERY high regard, at least here in Brazil. And I`m not even talking about the fight on the regular car market, where they fight toe-to-toe with Honda and Hyundai for the sedan market.
Thanks for bringing back audible memories from the 1980s. Of driving my s800 through the country lanes of Devon, giving a 2000cc Afla Romeo Spyder a run for its money at 100mph and getting a warning from the Police as he had heard me "coming for miles". Thanks
Grateful for the contributions of Mr. Ovaschtier and Mrs. Chicane.
The technology in these cars when new was fantastic, well above almost everything else. I had a friend with an S600 way back, he was a mechanical engineer, designed his own injection system, and his S600 put out 90hp...it was a blast
In 1966, when I was 14 I saw a red, right-hand drive S800 for the first time at my school. It made a bigger impression on me than my first view of a Cobra three years earlier. I often wondered whose kid was being collected by his cool mom. I've always loved tiny cars, and the Hondas were my benchmark.
I have a 1968 S800 which I have been restoring to all original in the past 14 years! It's coming out next week and I am super excited!
The appeal really of that car is just the revs and the sound it doesn't hurt hurt that it's absolutely beautiful
The sound is INSANE!!!
Stop drawing attention to these! These cars are already out of my price range. So much want.
I've had too many Honda's to list but I will say this, having a great shifter and being able to rev past 8k is addicting.
I lived in Japan in 1969 and owned a well-used S500. I still fantasize about owning one again.
That first upshift made my eyes water. Seriously. I love seeing you tear up LVR. I sometimes commute on it! Outstanding video!
Two Stroke Overhead Cam? who edits this stuff!
They just had boxes of camshafts stored in the attic, it’s a language barrier thing.
@@mikescherrer4923 Ha Ha
Prob Jason...lol
Yes with tdi rotary ignition
I noticed that, too. Glad someone mentioned it.
The sound of this little thing AWESOME!! 😍😍😍
That engine's sound is the aural manifestation and union of "eager and happy"!
That is such a cool car. I never realized I needed one till now...\
Today hyper expensive
I love the sound of a raucous 4 cylinder NA motor revved to an inch of its life. Makes me miss my non turbo'd cars of my past.
oh god listen to that sound!!!! glorioussss high revving engine sound, eargasm!!
The driving part at the end was just perfect it made me so happy for some reason 😊
I'd never watched Hagerty until Jason came.
Salute from Tokyo Jason!!
Same.
Awesome job Jason. Good to know that my S2000 is the successor of the car that defined Honda.
4:00 The tach goes to eleven! Yep, at the end we can indeed hear that the engine is one louder!
about 50 years ago I drove one of these. At the time I had a Prince Skyline GTR, gray with a deep blue roof. It was the fast steering that impressed me 1st. Then the tach just kept climbing. What a revelation. It handled! My Skyline with the heavy 6 cylinder engine and triple twin throat 40DCOE Webbers that wanted to plow in corners, with understeer that stopped you breathing, then, massive oversteer.
Fantastic content as usual Hagerty!! So glad Mr. Cammisa is doing Thursday videos :)!
I want the S800, it is my dream car and I love it
Sometimes you come across a series that you know you are gonna watch every episode of... This is it.
I'm a Honda driver since I got my drivers license and I knew, this car is awesome. You described it perfect! Thank you for this video.
Jason = click
Your comment = thank you. 😊
Jason's name appeared at the very end of this long video title, I almost missed it. But then I remembered it is Thursday, Jason's Video Day.
More like, Subscribed = click
@@JasonCammisa I'm glad that you have enough brand recognition to make a career on YT, but you don't have to appeal to such a LCD general audience or teenagers. In the long run it's better to write material for
The coupe version is just....
MMMMMMMMM It's BEAUTIFUL
This is the first driving footage at the end where you can see it's actually Jason driving! I didn't realise he got to drive the cars. What a job!
Love the desert at the end
Cammisa's videos are too good for us. Thank you, Hagerty!
Thank you!
Imagine Jason Cammisa and Chris Harris got together to make a car show
The discussions would be epic!
And Henry catchpole
It would be stupid, trust me. You don't want to see that.
Well, I can't stand Chris Harris, so I'd probably hate it. Sorry.
This is pure gold!! Jason, as always, on whichever channel, just makes it all perfect!
Jasons passion for cars really shows it self on this channel. it's good to be a car guy again.
Epic, well done Hagerty!
4:16 I didn't know that 2strokes engine had single overhead cam!!????? I never saw a 2strokes engine with a cam.
I used to work on a DOHC 2 stroke.
@@JoshuaTootell yeah!!! with 5valves per cylinder :)
Nope, four exhaust valves @@duber3
@@JoshuaTootell a 2strokes diesel??? in the case of the video he was talking about gaz engine and the image shown in the video was clearly a Four Strokes engine , I never saw a 2strokes gaz engine with cam and valves, show me!!
I was referring to diesel engines, yes. Haven't gone looking for a gasoline two stroke with a cam, I'm sure they have been made. I had a motorcycle years ago with a rotary valve two stroke though.
I once read an engineer's account of Soichiro Honda slapping him during a group presentation because he had scrambled to put his prototype together using a bolt that was way too long. The engineer said " I hated him for that, but I knew he was right" . Read that over 30 years ago and still think about it from time to time. Your excellent video was one of those times.
that engine sounds absolutely phenomenal
The brothers Ovaschtier, Les and Mo. They both are friends of Ms Chicane.
2 stroke, single overhead cam.
How the heck did that pass quality control?
1963 - no emissions control yet lol especially for motorcycle engines
Yep, it was the threat of those emissions controls that caused the revolutionary 3-stoke engine to never make it to production. 🤣
I was young, 19 YO. My Mom bought me a Honda S600 Sedan Coupe. Put a racing stripe on it and headed out onto the Tucson streets. My GREATEST memory is racing up Mt. Lemon's Catalina Hiway at midnight pushing that little monster to the limit of it's 600cc's and my guts. Don't remember a better run...
I have wanted one all my life, since first seeing one in 1966..
In other news, Adam Sandler has been spotted putting around in a loud, red bumper car from the 60s.
Makes me want to drive my S2000 lol
Love that we get a ride at the end
That little engine sounds fantastic
I used to take my miata on that last road. one thing i really miss about the bay area
Where is it?
@@Dribob That my friend is Lucas Valley road, if you keep going it leads to Skywalker Ranch
So many beautiful roads up there.
I would so love to have one of those.
I am a fan of the Car and Driver magazine articles of old. Jason Cammisa and Hagerty have captured the personality in the magazine articles I read for so many years. I look forward to every installment because of the quality of the writing and the personality of the presenter. Thank you.
I got to drive a Datsun 1600 Roadster back in 1970. I knew little about cars at the time and less about driving, but I recall that car as truly sexy. I had no memory of these earlier Hondas. What fantastic machines they were!
4:17 Overhead Cams on two stroke engines?! Is that a thing?
Camisa could replace Ryan Reynold as Deadpool and no one would notice
I was so bummed when JC left MT. But I’m way happier now. JC brings a fresh, interesting, and entertaining perspective to automotive history. Thank you, Hagerty.
Beautiful as always. Love that last bit. As Honda fan, thank you very much for this video.
Insane production quality, amazing host. Hoping to see more
“Why is it that all the cars I dream about are way too small for me?”
Says (The 6,4” 250 lbs Sasquatch that’s typing this)
PREACH! I am the same size guy. Why are we relegated to Excursion size vehicles or cars that cost more than our lifetime net earnings? :-)
So glad I’m 5,9 and 125 lbs I could fit anything😎
I owned, loved and morn the death of my Daihatsu K car. 6,1 264lbs man in a 660cc, 3cylinder motor with a 3speed auto. So much room and so much fun. Daihatsu Centro👌🏻
@@TheMxboy199 Dude, eat a hamburger.
@Def Bet I had a ‘95 F150 straight six 5spd. I put 350k on it best vehicle I ever had hands down. I then had an ‘06 F150 with a V6 6spd and rotors that warped and chattered every 10 miles.
Jason gets Excited talking about the S600! Amazing
As a fairly recent Honda convert this is the kind of classic car I had no idea existed. Wow, what a fun little machine this looks like!
Thanks for the great content! Old Japanese cars are hard to come by thanks to crap sheet metal they used back then.
10:11 Doug?
Jason is a fantastic host. Hagerty is putting out some of the best car content on CZcams.
Thanks for a fantastic review. And loved the drive after! Wow! I can totally understand why the S800 is such a legend.