Impressive what your guests accomplice, John, and impressive the number of interesting guests you get, and the way you assist them in informing and enlightening us. The library and documentation that you create this way is both important for contemporary sharing, and has historical significance.
Thank you so much! I’m very fortunate and honored to have so many knowledgeable and inspiring professionals and advocates willing to share their experiences and grateful that y’all are willing to tune in. Cheers! John
Keep up the good work...like you said we didnt get here in a decade and still we are adjusting traffic is an ever changing thing...in the Netherlands now the number of deadly cycle accidents has gone up for the first time since the 70's...the problem is the huge amount of elderly people on way to fast electric bicycles...so now they have to do something and it is probably going to be something like an obligation to wear a helmet on an electric bike...
I hope not... personal protective equipment and the dangerization of cycling have never worked and never will. Only safer conditions and slower speeds will make a difference.
Nice to see 2 Americans talking about biking in the Netherlands and how it could be in the States in the future. Sure it is possible,....1 of the things you often hear is that the NL is so flat and that's the reason why we have so many bikes. But the modern bikes with the enormous amount of gears makes it a lot easier, in the US most cities are flat too so it must be possible tooo. Well it will take some decades but city centers could become more car free. I live more in the green east of the NL, and a car is more "needed" because of the distances to go to your job by example. It is not like in the west of the NL (Amsterdam, The Haque, Rotterdam, Utrecht) were there is a close network for trains(in combination with the enormous bycicle parkings). trams, busses etc. We don't have that, so it is slightly different. But still we have too the advantages of the infrastructure (bikepaths) that is laid out in the whole of the NL. In my erea many children bike to their schools, around 30 km per day (15 go - 15 back) only in the winter....if possible the bus.
@@ActiveTowns Thanks, my area is around Enschede. I'm training on a race bycicle and go mostly into Germany (10 km from the border) But the difference is really great to see & feel. The advantage is that the area in Germany is green also and not so populated. The number of cars is more limited, but still I have to train on many roads side by side with cars speeding 80 km p/h. Since those Garmin devices excists you can find a lot of "alternative" roads and paths a blessing. In German cities you directly feel the missing of what is in the NL the normal standard for bikers.Although I have to confess that the German border area has picked up at least the building of bycicle road/paths seperated next to the car roads. But it is a fraction, tourism has a lot to do with it. I forgot to wish you all to have succes with your ideas in the USA, it will take decades but keep pushing and show pictures & videos from the NL as example and try to find a mix.
This kind off building a new town is already started a long time ago in the Netherlands!I live in Almere (near Amsterdam!)and the first houses and roads are already build this way in the seventies!!
As the topic was raised a couple of times, I was reminded of a joke: Q: What came first, the chicken or the egg? A: Safety, cause safety always comes first.
They have little reflective bumps between car lanes, but I've never seen them between the car and bike lanes. There should be the same tactile notice that the car is leaving the lane on that as well. As is, the cars treat the bike lane as an extension of the car lane on inside curves. At a minimum there should be reflector dots. Better to have stupid plastic posts to show where the lane is. Best to have actual physical separation, but I've learned not to expect intelligence.
NL guy here, watching these video's from time to time as well as some other channels on infrastructure. What I don't really understand is the fixation on bollards and reflector posts and other signage that seems to be there wherever there's a bike lane introduced in places like US and Canada. Be it as a temporary measure such as 1:30:02 or in some videos I've seen of bike lanes in larger cities. I'm wondering what the reasoning is of this, as well as excessive / confusing nonstandard signage often introduced there. Because the rows and rows of plastic bollards, often bent and broken, just look terrible, and I feel they're anxiety inducing for all types of traffic, be it cyclists (especially when it gets more crowded), parking cars (trying not to hit the posts with the door) and any other motorised traffic, trying not to scratch the paint. I mean I would not like riding alongside that, especially if you do hit it and, knowing how bike steering works, chances are higher you get flung on the road instead of back on the bike path. Just a tiny bit of graded curbstone would to the trick just as well. Looking at some of the new paths it feels like the planners or whomever are either proudly saying "look at this, we did this", or are so afraid drivers won't be able to figure out the situation that they just jam an excessive amount of signage and posts etc. on the road hoping that draws attention / fixes the issue. Solutions like 1:28:09 are much more elegant. I feel (also as a driver) that the more "in your face" signage / infrastructure is, forcing you to, instead of steering you to do something, the more you can grow to resent it instead of going with the flow. hope this makes sense. Anyway to get back to the question : Is it just that bollards and posts are the only sure way of keeping traffic off the bike path without needing a physical surface change such as curbstones? The reason I wrote all this and what caught my eye was those posts in the middle of a two way cycle path crossing at 1:10:28. That is just a terrible idea. We almost never see that (anymore) here in cycletopia as it's an accident waiting to happen if there's some cycle traffic. The positioning of the posts could be much worse, but If you just need to indicate to drivers that thers's a crossing, I'd put posts on either side of the path or wherever but not in the middle. my 2 cents.
There are 3 answers: 1) there are no good guide lines so everyone is just doing whatever the like. 2) Money, those stupid flex poles are cheap and paint is even cheaper. 3) US drivers can't drive, they will drive on a cycle path as it is not very clear that it is not for them .... and some of them will still drive/park on a bike path. After writing, I saw this: 47:08
Pretty much what Buddy said… mainly that too many lives have been lost through fatal crashes of drivers getting confused and driving downs and/or parking in the the bidirectional cycle paths. Thanks so much for watching and the detailed response. Cheers! John
@@ActiveTowns Right. so it is a matter of necessity really. That's unfortunate. Still, I feel if the public space is beautiful as well as functional that would also help induce better behaviour. one can dream. All of the proposed ideas do look like great improvements by the way, don't get me wrong. Keep doing what you're doing!
@@buddy1155 Yeah all obvious answers of course. was hoping there was a method to it. Yeah that "turn lane" is interesting. If that were a place in NL with just the painted line and no other indication (that I could see), I wouldn't even blame the driver. That would never be a bike path. Maybe a bus lane or an emergency lane. The bike path would be where the sidewalk is, or at least separated from the rest by a square curb. The whole spacing of everything looks off to me so it's difficult to figure out where everything would go on the existing surfaces. In any case, with a 2 lane road there's ALWAYS at least a square curb in between cars and bikes here as far as I can tell. Even if it's only a couple feet wide, that's enough to show the difference in modes and make sure it cant be driven over at speed. Emergency vehicles can then still use the lane, and they do if necessary.
@@HarmenBrouwer I think I also haven't seen an unprotected bike path on a two lane road. But I think there is always a protected bike path if there is high volume of cars. And there would only be a two lane road if there is a high volume of cars. Especially if there is space for a second lane the Dutch will also find space for a separated bike path.
Remember...you can have rhe most beautiful bike lanes but that isn't a guarantee for safe roads...it is also about changing the car drivers attitude....the dutch did it by making cars yield to bicycles within city limits... unless indicated otherwise...so...when hitting a bicycle your car insurance goes up...the best way to change the Dutch their behaviour is through their wallet... Believe me i know...i am Dutch...😉😄
Yep, we dont have to put much more bycycle infrastructure as we have a lot already, some improvements here and there, and thats it. Greetings from the netherlands. Cheers :)
@@lexburen5932 Yeah, I always like to point out that the work is never truly done, there's always an opportunity to fine tune as conditions evolve. Thanks so much for tuning in. Much appreciated. John 😀
I live in Amsterdam . I am riding always with my bike to my work. It’s 10 kilometers and I’m passing only 2 stoplights. The rest is a save bike lane.
Love it! A truly civilized way to live. Thanks so much for tuning in. Cheers! John
Impressive what your guests accomplice, John, and impressive the number of interesting guests you get, and the way you assist them in informing and enlightening us.
The library and documentation that you create this way is both important for contemporary sharing, and has historical significance.
Thank you so much! I’m very fortunate and honored to have so many knowledgeable and inspiring professionals and advocates willing to share their experiences and grateful that y’all are willing to tune in. Cheers! John
It's a lot easier to make a wide road narrower than the reverse.
Yes! So true. 🙌
Interesting concepts for improving the safety of streets. Still the best improvement is slower speeds and protected lanes.
Agreed! Thanks so much for tuning in for the Premiere. Cheers! John
And separate routes.
Keep up the good work...like you said we didnt get here in a decade and still we are adjusting traffic is an ever changing thing...in the Netherlands now the number of deadly cycle accidents has gone up for the first time since the 70's...the problem is the huge amount of elderly people on way to fast electric bicycles...so now they have to do something and it is probably going to be something like an obligation to wear a helmet on an electric bike...
I hope not... personal protective equipment and the dangerization of cycling have never worked and never will. Only safer conditions and slower speeds will make a difference.
Great talk! Too bad that we need to take "baby steps" here in North America, but it's great to see so many places moving in the right direction. 😊
So true! Hopefully, as the number of installations grows and networks begin to take shape, the momentum and pace of change also accelerate.
Hey, babysteps is where the Netherlands got where it is.
Love it!!
Delighted you were able to tune in! ❤️
Nice to see 2 Americans talking about biking in the Netherlands and how it could be in the States in the future. Sure it is possible,....1 of the things you often hear is that the NL is so flat and that's the reason why we have so many bikes.
But the modern bikes with the enormous amount of gears makes it a lot easier, in the US most cities are flat too so it must be possible tooo. Well it will take some decades but city centers could become more car free.
I live more in the green east of the NL, and a car is more "needed" because of the distances to go to your job by example. It is not like in the west of the NL (Amsterdam, The Haque, Rotterdam, Utrecht) were there is a close network for trains(in combination with the enormous bycicle parkings). trams, busses etc. We don't have that, so it is slightly different. But still we have too the advantages of the infrastructure (bikepaths) that is laid out in the whole of the NL. In my erea many children bike to their schools, around 30 km per day (15 go - 15 back) only in the winter....if possible the bus.
Thanks so much watching! I hope to explore your area a bit this summer. Cheers! John
@@ActiveTowns Thanks, my area is around Enschede. I'm training on a race bycicle and go mostly into Germany (10 km from the border) But the difference is really great to see & feel. The advantage is that the area in Germany is green also and not so populated. The number of cars is more limited, but still I have to train on many roads side by side with cars speeding 80 km p/h. Since those Garmin devices excists you can find a lot of "alternative" roads and paths a blessing. In German cities you directly feel the missing of what is in the NL the normal standard for bikers.Although I have to confess that the German border area has picked up at least the building of bycicle road/paths seperated next to the car roads. But it is a fraction, tourism has a lot to do with it.
I forgot to wish you all to have succes with your ideas in the USA, it will take decades but keep pushing and show pictures & videos from the NL as example and try to find a mix.
@@love-vy1ry Sounds fun! Yes, that's plan. Keep the pressure on and build momentum 😀
'cul-de-sac through laneways' yes please.
All day long 🙌
I wish I could make a rendering like the ones shown toward the end to show to my city council/engineers.
Hmmm... I'm pretty sure you can. I don't believe that it is all that difficult. Thanks so much for tuning in. Cheers! John
This kind off building a new town is already started a long time ago in the Netherlands!I live in Almere (near Amsterdam!)and the first houses and roads are already build this way in the seventies!!
Cool! Almere is on my list of places to visit this summer. Thanks so much for tuning in. I really appreciate it. Cheers! John
Ok,maybe we see echt other.
@@jooproos6559 Hehe, maybe. I'll be the guy on a wee folding bike with an Active Towns hat. 🙌
As the topic was raised a couple of times, I was reminded of a joke:
Q: What came first, the chicken or the egg?
A: Safety, cause safety always comes first.
Hehe 😂 yep, pretty much. 🙌
They have little reflective bumps between car lanes, but I've never seen them between the car and bike lanes. There should be the same tactile notice that the car is leaving the lane on that as well.
As is, the cars treat the bike lane as an extension of the car lane on inside curves.
At a minimum there should be reflector dots. Better to have stupid plastic posts to show where the lane is. Best to have actual physical separation, but I've learned not to expect intelligence.
🙌
NL guy here, watching these video's from time to time as well as some other channels on infrastructure.
What I don't really understand is the fixation on bollards and reflector posts and other signage that seems to be there wherever there's a bike lane introduced in places like US and Canada. Be it as a temporary measure such as 1:30:02 or in some videos I've seen of bike lanes in larger cities.
I'm wondering what the reasoning is of this, as well as excessive / confusing nonstandard signage often introduced there. Because the rows and rows of plastic bollards, often bent and broken, just look terrible, and I feel they're anxiety inducing for all types of traffic, be it cyclists (especially when it gets more crowded), parking cars (trying not to hit the posts with the door) and any other motorised traffic, trying not to scratch the paint. I mean I would not like riding alongside that, especially if you do hit it and, knowing how bike steering works, chances are higher you get flung on the road instead of back on the bike path. Just a tiny bit of graded curbstone would to the trick just as well.
Looking at some of the new paths it feels like the planners or whomever are either proudly saying "look at this, we did this", or are so afraid drivers won't be able to figure out the situation that they just jam an excessive amount of signage and posts etc. on the road hoping that draws attention / fixes the issue. Solutions like 1:28:09 are much more elegant. I feel (also as a driver) that the more "in your face" signage / infrastructure is, forcing you to, instead of steering you to do something, the more you can grow to resent it instead of going with the flow. hope this makes sense.
Anyway to get back to the question : Is it just that bollards and posts are the only sure way of keeping traffic off the bike path without needing a physical surface change such as curbstones?
The reason I wrote all this and what caught my eye was those posts in the middle of a two way cycle path crossing at 1:10:28. That is just a terrible idea. We almost never see that (anymore) here in cycletopia as it's an accident waiting to happen if there's some cycle traffic. The positioning of the posts could be much worse, but If you just need to indicate to drivers that thers's a crossing, I'd put posts on either side of the path or wherever but not in the middle. my 2 cents.
There are 3 answers:
1) there are no good guide lines so everyone is just doing whatever the like.
2) Money, those stupid flex poles are cheap and paint is even cheaper.
3) US drivers can't drive, they will drive on a cycle path as it is not very clear that it is not for them .... and some of them will still drive/park on a bike path.
After writing, I saw this: 47:08
Pretty much what Buddy said… mainly that too many lives have been lost through fatal crashes of drivers getting confused and driving downs and/or parking in the the bidirectional cycle paths. Thanks so much for watching and the detailed response. Cheers! John
@@ActiveTowns Right. so it is a matter of necessity really. That's unfortunate.
Still, I feel if the public space is beautiful as well as functional that would also help induce better behaviour. one can dream.
All of the proposed ideas do look like great improvements by the way, don't get me wrong. Keep doing what you're doing!
@@buddy1155 Yeah all obvious answers of course. was hoping there was a method to it.
Yeah that "turn lane" is interesting. If that were a place in NL with just the painted line and no other indication (that I could see), I wouldn't even blame the driver. That would never be a bike path. Maybe a bus lane or an emergency lane. The bike path would be where the sidewalk is, or at least separated from the rest by a square curb. The whole spacing of everything looks off to me so it's difficult to figure out where everything would go on the existing surfaces.
In any case, with a 2 lane road there's ALWAYS at least a square curb in between cars and bikes here as far as I can tell. Even if it's only a couple feet wide, that's enough to show the difference in modes and make sure it cant be driven over at speed. Emergency vehicles can then still use the lane, and they do if necessary.
@@HarmenBrouwer I think I also haven't seen an unprotected bike path on a two lane road.
But I think there is always a protected bike path if there is high volume of cars.
And there would only be a two lane road if there is a high volume of cars. Especially if there is space for a second lane the Dutch will also find space for a separated bike path.
Remember...you can have rhe most beautiful bike lanes but that isn't a guarantee for safe roads...it is also about changing the car drivers attitude....the dutch did it by making cars yield to bicycles within city limits... unless indicated otherwise...so...when hitting a bicycle your car insurance goes up...the best way to change the Dutch their behaviour is through their wallet...
Believe me i know...i am Dutch...😉😄
Yes! We need this desperately. Thanks😀
The US will outpace the Netherlands soon on bike infrastructure.
Hehe, I wish this were true. We have so much ground makeup. Thanks so much for tuning in. Cheers! John
Yep, we dont have to put much more bycycle infrastructure as we have a lot already, some improvements here and there, and thats it. Greetings from the netherlands. Cheers :)
@@lexburen5932 Yeah, I always like to point out that the work is never truly done, there's always an opportunity to fine tune as conditions evolve. Thanks so much for tuning in. Much appreciated. John 😀