I have been watching debates for the past couple of months between Catholics vs everyone. What a rich Tradition and depth the Catholic Church has in its knowledge of God. I may never fully understand all of it but my faith has increased in THE church. Raised by a Catholic mother and a Baptist Father. I could never leave the church that has the Authority and Eucharist! Blessed be the name of the Lord!
Very well stated. It seems that our Protestant friends have made a habit of protesting The Catholic Faith without any real knowledge of what they dislike /hate. I believe that Catholics have largely ignored the attacks and are only recently defending the depth, breadth and scope of the Truth.
I’m a former feral RBap, currently high church Anglican, but very sympathetic to Roman Catholic theology. This debate (to me anyway) was one of the most devastating of White’s career. Jimmy really brought out the self-refuting nature of Sola Scriptura and “Faith Alone” as portrayed by Protestants. I’ve learned that most of what I️ think I️ know about the RCC is based on Protestant midcharacterization. Keep up the great work Jimmy! Your work has really expanded my understanding and I️ know I’m not the only one.
@@mewster1818 Yes,I suffered from it ,two yrs ago .Fortunately ,it was resolved by meds,including herbal ,but did have a hospital visit .Its one of those moments that you say to yourself"I would rather die than keep suffering from this pain" . Im glad he is home and okay now .We need him !
Realizing through debates by Jimmy and Trent Horn that sola scriptura was false was the first step in my conversion to catholicism. Glory to Jesus Christ!
I watched both debates and Akin came across exactly as he said: loving , knowledgeable, approachable, on topic. James came across as if he knew / knows everything-self -righteous, prideful. I was baptized catholic, then became Protestant. After many years, I returned to my Catholic faith. I’m never looking back. ❤Thank you Mr. Akin for your presence at the debate and presenting with LOVE and clear understanding. Towards the end of the 2nd debate, Akin drew conclusions that we Protestants and Catholics have agreements: the Trinity! ❤
Yep, never liked him even when I was a Protestant. There was always just something about him that made me avoid him. I have no hate for the guy, but a little humility could go a long way lol
Its because Jimmy's points are so new to this conversation. I have never heard a Catholic admit to many things that (growing up in the Church) I have heard before.
Great debate, Jimmy you did a very good job of being charitable and professional. You’re my favorite Catholic apologist. God bless you, brother. Keep up the great work.🙏✝️🇻🇦
Appreciate what you do, Jimmy! I'm a recent convert to the church from being a reformed Baptist the past few years. Your content has helped me on this crazy journey!
Congrats!! I was raised Reformed Baptist (but from lovely God fearing parents so please don’t think of James white when you think of my family!!), became an Anglican for 20 Years and than joined the Church. It’s so amazing being able to receive the fullness of the faith and our Lord in the Eucharist, isn’t it?!? James white always overloads in his debates. I wasn’t familiar with those terms but it’s what he does except I would say he does it to gain the support of his audience based on their dislike for the add pms he makes rather than him being able to argue a case in there current debate. It is so unethical and wrong.
Your closing statement that pointed out sola Scriptura is a "post-biblical inference" (and that White agreed with that) that phrase really caught my attention. When White, Ortlund, and The Other Paul concede this, they don't even realize how much they've given away. Especially because it undercuts completely any Scripture citations they provide for sola Scriptura. How can one be consistent in quoting Scripture to prove a post biblical inference?
If I'm not mistaken, White has declined to debate you before saying you weren't bringing anything new to the table. It surprised me how offended he seemed to be by your novel angle in the debate
That’s not accurate. AOMin had attempted for years to arrange a debate with Jimmy. Catholic Answers declined. What White actually said was “Why do you want to debate only Sola Scriptura? Why not debate the changes to Roman Catholicism under Pope Francis”. It was Matt Fradd that claimed White refused to debate Akin. I contacted AOMin. And was told that they had heard nothing from Akin nor C.A regarding a desire to debate.
@@PaulLaChapelleThere haven't been any changes to Catholicism under Pope Francis, despite what the secular press claims. As my late Dad taught me in my childhood, "The Pope can say that the sky is green and the grass is blue, but Catholics don't have to believe it," because it isn't true. Whatever error Pope Francis believes, it doesn't change Church teaching. The reason White believes that Pope Francis changed Church teaching is because he doesn't understand the role of the Pope (and it's possible that Francis does, too).
Jimmy you're a true gem for the catholic faith. Using a conciliatory approach to "confront" White was genius. White does not really have any logical or historical case against us, rather it's all really just personal with him, such that when you said we agree multiple times he seemed quite peeved. Also he seemed rather uncomfortable talking about faith from a love/charity perspective. I'm glad you hit him on that extensively even though his answers were kinda lame. The moment he starts deflecting with marian dogmas and indulgences etc... that means he can't answer the question. Bravo! Great job! Please debate more. I feel like other catholic apologists lack in centering these debates on love. I'm glad you brought that back into the limelight.
Hopefully James White will someday figure out that he's not going to win debates by means of his snide and off-topic remarks, and his general unpleasantness. Enjoyed this discussion!!
Jimmy I live 10 min from that church and attend St Margaret’s church just up the road. I’m crushed I wasn’t aware of the debate and would have loved to have attended. Thank you for being a soldier of Christ and defending Holy mother church
I appreciate Jimmy's style especially in a world where our polemics are all about making our opponents look stupid or painting them as enemies. There is a way to speak and defend the Truth charitably and firmly.
I didn't really get that. I think Akin performed a little better than White in the debate, but not by a very wide margin. Neither really said anything too impactful to drive the conversation forward. Both represented their sides decently well. Edit: sorry I just realized I only watched the sola scriptura debate. I don't know which debate night 2 was. I might not have seen it.
@@not_milk yeah, no worries. The debates as a whole were fairly even (slight edge to Akin), but the night-two cross-examination was a big dub for Jimmy. You'll have to give it a watch - top shelf stuff.
@@matthewstevenson6835 I'm really curious to see that now. Was night 2 the justification one? I tend toward favoring a middle road between the Catholic and protestant views of justification.
I love how James White’s positions all stem from how HE interprets scripture rather than the institution (the Church) that compiled it under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Every time he brings up a Catholic teaching, it devolves into “because ROME…” as if there’s no biblical basis for the catechism. It’s almost like he believes there’s no distinction between the Roman Empire and the Catholic Church.
James White is a Calvinist and his stated beliefs reflect what John Calvin taught in The Institutes of the Christian Religion, followed by the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith that was composed by Puritan divines who were Calvin's followers in England.
@@keelyemerine-mix1051 that’s an interesting statement. If Jimmy won then the Catholic point of view is correct. We are all Brothers and sisters who love Christ. There can only be one truth so I hope you at least consider joining the Church started by Jesus and not by Martin Luther. Heaven is easier to reach through the Catholic church
Jimmy Akin is the only apologist of any theological persuasion who looks like he could also be in a ZZ Top tribute band. That is NOT a negative comment against Jimmy. He is a sharp dressed man! Incidentally, I’m not Catholic, but I did call into Catholic Answers some years ago while Jimmy was hosting. He was very gracious. They sent me his book, “The Drama of Salvation”, which was a good read.
I noted the petty remark made about Jimmy running on 30 seconds during the first round. At that exact moment I had a sense that other nonsensical tactics would be used by White. For example, White referencing the repeated litanies of other debates with other Catholic apologist. Those were failed attempts, arguably egotistical, to inject some gravitas and credibility to his presentation.
Jimmy, you really are amazing. I could only imagine Moses coming down from the mountain with the ten commandments, and the people saying "we don't accept your ten commandments because it is not in our bible"...it's beyond baffling.
Hi Jimmy, only 30 minutes into this debrief. In case you don't cover this question in the remaining 90 minutes, how did the attendees respond to you at the end of these debates? Given that this was a Baptist Church, I'm wondering if any were persuaded by your excellent arguments.
I really like this comment. I would also like to hear what the crowd thought. I personally feel that most baptist are very friendly so that's what I would expect. (I'm Lutheran)
This always happens when a Protestant debates a Catholic. The guidelines of the debate go out the window on the premise that the issues are important to discuss. Bogus, follow the rules.
I agree regarding Mr. White's cranky demeanor. It's not a helpful or charitable Christian temperament (and sadly one I deal with myself). I've found this is common amongst reformed Christians I encounter in even casual theological dialogue (I'm a convert from a non reformed protestant background and don't consider myself an apologist). One fellow, still a friend, stated that God is not a loving entity, which I thought was reasonably consistent with his calvinist understanding.
White came form an abusive family Like Luther did And both are looking to attack back but to afraid to take it to their parents so they that take it to another authority the Pope and the Catholic Church a lot easier for them. Cowardly
I totally agree reformed Protestants tend to be really harsh and uncharitable. Probably because of their framework of God. I’d be angry too, if I believed God created people solely to go to hell.
Jimmy blew James out of the water. Great Job pray James White realizes Jesus Christ founded only one Church and historically only one Church can be traced back to the Apostles and Jesus Christ.
I noticed the overloading in the debate. You forgot the Alphonsus Liguori quote in the second night. Against Trent Horn he brought up the The Brown Scapular.
I'm a protestant that questions some of the doctrine of every different denomination but White just comes off arrogant in these debates. A lot of these issues the catholic church and protestants disagree on don't effect the fundamental teachings of Jesus therefore don't effect salvation. Its not like Catholics are mormon or something 🤣
@@michaelvilleneuve8292 You got a different definition of fundamental than I do but I know there's people in every denomination of christianity that think every other ones hellhound because they don't agree with say babtism age, Sunday worship.... I got amish neighbors that are basically legalist trying to be "good" and get to heaven. I'm sure are convinced me and you are going to hell🤣
Dear@@michaelvilleneuve8292, @mrbill4187 did say "some." His point is that he agrees that the Church is Christian. I'll take that! I do get tired of being told that I am automatically going to Hell because I discerned the Catholic Church is the Church Jesus founded and continues to accompany. Jesus is ALIVE!
When it comes to Sola Scriptura Protestants commit the motte and Bailey fallacy. What they really believe (the Bailey): Scripture is sufficient to formulate all Christian doctrine and all Christian doctrine must be proved from scripture. What they pretend they’re really saying (the motte): All we’re saying is Scripture is the only thing that’s infallible.
@@janegildart7585 That is more or less what I mean. Scripture is the first and primary source of understanding our faith; but it would be foolish to dismiss the recorded traditions of the early church to which Protestants more less ascribe.
Holy Scripture teaches we must cooperate with God's saving grace and repent and bear fruit and forgive others and love one another and keep the commandments and persevere to the end to be saved! James White says, "not true ". James White will NEVER admit that his interpretations are Fallible! Ironic!🤔 Jimmy Akin is amazing, humble and brilliant! !Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and Kind God and Savior, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink drink!
I just watched the 2 debriefs .. from James W and Jimmy A. It is striking the difference ... Jimmy wants to do the best possible debate within the bounds of charity and describes a very methododical approach trying to push certain topics and cover all possible rebuttals. James W appears to have accepted terms he was not sure about and comes across as having done the debate before there is nothing new to argue and he has the stronger argument ... before the debate starts. James fails to see (or acknowledge) that Jimmy A was very astute in doing homework to have slides on many possible rebuttals. Thanks to both debaters in providing information and putting forward your thoughts on both debates. I dont watch debates to "see" a winner... I watch them to gain knowledge on the topic and learn. I really enjoyed these debates!!
I think it may be hard for some of us older generation to get past the fact that it is disrespectful for a man to wear a hat indoors and especially a church. Big no no regardless of the “look”, but was glad to see the debate for sure.
Well, for one that didn't look like a church. It looks like a conference hall. For another, Catholics aren't obligated to remove their hat in a non-Catholic Church. This was a Protestant place.
Akin you really did a good job in the whole debate, and in the cross examination for Sola Scriptura! I noticed! You were very precise in your cross-examination and got to the heart of the issue on Sola Scriptura. Meanwhile, White kept pressing you about the "outgrowth" of a non-Sola Scriptura doctrine, which is the Apostolic Paradigm, in his cross-examination such as the Marian dogma, Indulgences, Fiducia Supplicans, etc., which are honestly, totally irrelevant is what I've noticed. Those weren't the heart of the issue on your side. The heart was the Apostolic Paradigm, and whether he could prove his case that Sola Scriptura is a thing in Scriptures. He wasn't able to do either of those, as in provide evidence that the Apostolic Tradition isn't real, based on his definition, and Sola Scriptura being in the function of Scriptures itself, and instead just tried to paint the Catholic Church as bad because it's outgrowth is not Sola Scriptura, which doesn't matter because the Catholic Church does not subscribe to that doctrine. He had to prove first that Sola Scriptura is the only legitimate infallible authority which he did not. Also, I don't think you brought this out explicitly, probably because of the time limit, but you were able to implicate from White that his point about "You can't have Sola Scriptura, without Scriptura", could not be possible in the Early Church history, because the canon of NT scriptures were not yet established (by repeatedly pointing to the death of the Apostles). So how could he Sola Scriptura, without Scriptura to base on? Hence, there had to be an infallible authority outside of scriptures to determine the course of the Church, and even which canon to consider. I got that impression as you cross-examined him which was really amazing! I also learned a few things about our Church that I didn't know thanks to that debate. I knew that whatever the Pope says on the media isn't all infallible, but I didn't know that it is also the case with Church documents. I didn't know there was a specific criteria to it to determine infallibility. Thank you on that!
Great debate. But since the topic came up, I think Jimmy needs a makeover, maybe take a foot off the beard? That way he could look great with a bolo tie, maybe a vest and large beltbuckle and some rhinestones here and there. James White’s beard also needs a good trimming. Akin’s attitude was great, while White did come across as someone who sees himself as an authority, when all he is is a self appointed freelance Bible interpreter presenting his opinion. Akin simply presented the teachings of the Church.
Hi Mr. Akin! I remember thinking to myself during your first rebuttal in the first debate, "How does he have a slide addressing exactly what Mr. White had brought up only few moments before"? I thought your slides fit perfectly in the rebuttal rounds. Very very cool. You are the best. Also, if you could choose one catholic apologist to defend the faith alongside you, who would you choose?
I think James White’ thought process is something like this: the non sola scriptura side can’t explain the pope , Mary etc… and Jimmy hasn’t explained it; ergo sola scriptural side is the e way to go.
I've wondered why Jimmy did'nt expand when Mr. White commented on 2 Thes.2:15 that what St. Paul meant is that the tradition already received by the Thesalonians is the Gospel which is self refuting. I mean the first of letters of Paul is these Letters to Thesalonians. So does St. Paul imparted orally the Gospel according to, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John? how about the letter of Peter, James, etc, etc.
I've never met James White. I have seen him debate many times, against many people. I really dislike his tactics, many of his deflections and arguments. I see him as a fundamentally dishonest actor in the theological realm, unable to listen and learn from others. I don't like that. Also, White often displays anger, hostility, meanness and nastiness. I don't like that either. I think this mainly happens when he is confronted with the weakness, or falsity of his own arguments, and he has no comeback.
Mr. Akin- married to a unreasonable Protestant wife, Ive learned a lot from you as the best way to evangelize to her... unfortunately I'm married to a James White type-
Hi Jimmy. Good job on the debates. You might want to edit the title for this debriefing video. "Justification". Will help for future when people search for this. Cheerio.
Honestly, I thought James White was less than gracious. It felt like he wasn’t there to debate the topics, but rather to attack an enemy. I think the “wrong color” cowboy hat comment meant Jimmy should have been wearing a black cowboy hat, like the bad guys in Western movies. That seemed indicative of James Whites mindset, and that he thinks everyone is on his side while fighting the Catholic enemy. I particularly enjoyed the new content Jimmy Aiken brought to the debate. Completely caught White off guard and all he could do was cry “not fair” when he couldn’t use his canned rebuttals. Masterfully done Mr. Aiken.
Jimmy was being nice by say Mr. White is consistent. In James said it was weird that Jimmy had slides for his rebuttals. Another word is better describing him would be predictable.
Jimmy, I’d love to hear from you. I was Protestant for 38 years, my entire life. I began feel an urge to turn to the Catholic Church and began listening to you. It’s transformed my life, I’m currently looking into converting. I have a question I’d love to hear you speak on. As a former Baptist from the Bible Belt, I Knew very few Calvinist. Most Baptist I know of don’t even agree with their beliefs. But when I watch debates all I see is the Calvinist position being approached like it’s the standard for Protestantism. Isn’t it true that Calvinist are a small minority in the religious community that no one agrees with? Why are they seen as the standard for protestantism during these theology discussions? Doesn’t it matter than their view is so small it should be highlighted? I never see this brought up.
I have had false statements thrust upon me by Protestants, out of the blue, about "facts" purported to be true. Each time, further discussion revealed that the false information was obtained, in church, from their minister. I don't know why they don't simply mind their own business. I have been Catholic for 69 years and never, not once, heard a Priest, or educator, talk about any perceived fallacies of Protestantism. This includes 16 years of Catholic education ranging from first grade through a college, with an associated seminary. I simply wish Protestantism would transcend from being in part an active verb to be only a noun. That, is quit protesting and move on.
The funniest part of the first debate was James White deridingly pointing out how Jimmy somehow had a slide for every one of his rebuttals, as if that was somehow a bad thing for Jimmy.
Hey jimmy…. I love this content ive learned so much. Ive fallen prey to overload many times and have learned to avoid it by staying on topic through sheer trial and error. I think a van diagram might be helpful to show opponents in the future how apostolic tradition can be but isnt limited to the gospel. Same goes with scripture, oral preaching, god’s word, and tradition. I wonder if it can be done im trying to imagine it. I think it could be helpful in my debates, im always hit with the “define the gospel” trap where if i say too little or too much its outside of the gospel or under defines it. These days i just say “”you go first” and pull the same trick on them, i find it an unsatisfactory way of handling the question.
If Jimmy sees this, I have a question. I am wondering about the conception of time between Protestants and Catholics. It seems as if Protestants (Calvinists in particular) seem to take a God-like view of time and try to see past, present, and future as one, even though we live in time. James referred to the "already not yet" in the debate. This would explain their understanding of justification as being life-long, as well as the notion of predestination as being one with the elect and the reprobate. But Catholics understand that, because we live in time, God applies grace and forgiveness - in other words, the finished work of the cross as being ongoing - to us in time. Might this distinction get at the heart of our disagreements on this matter?
Thanks for this. It really smoothed out some questions I had about the debates. Probably the most important criticism I've heard regards Jimmy Akin having different viewpoints than other Catholics on the topic of justification.
I was so glad that Jimmy referenced the 1999 "Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification." Totally Orthodox Catholic Teaching, but in terms that some people are not familiar with.
Jimmy definitely got under James White's skin. It showed when James White petulantly complained that Jimmy had gone 30 seconds over on his presentation.
The problem was that I was in the middle of reading a chart at the end of my opening statement, and failing to read the back half of the chart would have just been super-disorienting. But 30 seconds is only 30 seconds, and I'm happy for balance. That's why I told White if he wanted another 30 seconds, I had his back.
Jimmy A.: "The Church's approach for decades has been to look for common ground on this." This is really funny. There is no Deposit of the Faith if you think the last few decades determinative of anything. We have a 2000-year old Deposit. I do find that Jimmy often goes overboard toward protestantism. I realize he is a convert from protestantism, and I have usually let it slide because, I say to myself, "he just doesn't have those Catholic bones." But I find it a red flag that he thinks he's putting it better than Mitch Pacwa, Patrick Madrid, et al. When you set up to speak for Catholicism, don't stab us in the back: This faith alone/ not alone problem is real such that it divided all of Christiendom, and to soft pedal what is at stake is not helpful. The true Faith is that we are saved by grace through faith lived out in love. All Of That. Protestantism refuses to admit this obvious scriptural reality, and pretending we can say, very carefully and very conditionally, that we are saved by faith alone, is simply unhelpful. I expect Mr. A. scoffs at verbiage from before the last few decades such as "Treasury of Merit," but I've been a Catholic for a lot longer than he has, in a long line of Catholics all well -formed, and there is true, as the Catholic Church has done for eons, that we can help merit in and with Christ, our own salvation--carefully and conditionally understood. That is the teaching that needs to be carefully understood, not "faith alone". Our apologists need to defend not jettison the classic, customary ways in which Catholicism has habituated her children. That said, I thoroughly enjoyed the debate and appreciated all the beautiful and careful defending of the Faith that Mr. Akin did. I loved the slides and took notes! He is a gentleman and a kind scholar.
Sometimes Catholics are too ecumenical towards Protestants & others quite frankly. It's a bit of a tightrope because you want to invite people in but you also can't compromise and appeal to non-Catholic beliefs
That's a long way to say "I don't like the way you do apologetics". Because that's all there is here. You didn't prove Jimmy put forth an error (because he didn't) and you didn't prove alternative ways to frame the disagreement are more or less helpful than the way Jimmy chose to approach it.
@@pmlm1571 The Deposit of Faith is here, and strong! Look at the church's recent authoritative interpretation of the Deposit of Faith which allows her to disprove transgender ideology.
I've wondered why Jimmy did'nt expand when Mr. White commented on 2 Thes.2:15 that what St. Paul meant is that the tradition already received by the Thesalonians is the Gospel which is self refuting. I mean the first of letters of Paul is these Letters to Thesalonians. So does St. Paul imparted orally the Gospel according to, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John? how about the letter of Peter, James, etc, etc. Therefore, he still need to accept the Authority of the Catholic Church with regards to his position.
Jimmy, I know you’re trying to disarm your opponent when you clap for them, or clap for the audience, such as “congratulations you’re not anathema!”, but it comes off rather patronizing. This said, you dominate these debates.
Yes, I completely agree. I think your humor and personableness come out with it as well as the point you are making in a much better way (with verbalizing but not clapping). Small point. So thankful for you fighting for the truth. And doing it so well and so charitably, brother.
I think in his Ehrman debate it came off as lest patronizing than with James White. I am not sure why. I think if Jimmy just left out the clapping it would be great.
one point I'd like to see someone make to White, or any Reformed apologist, is that the idea of "imputing" righteousness to us is the basis for merits and the treasury of saints - God imputes the rewards of X to Y, and Y builds up on that to further his own righteousness
At the heart of Jimmy's use of slides is the idea that White's arguments were so predictable, as Jimmy noted here. Jimmy had a slide prepared to accompany a rebuttal to essentially any central claim White would likely make. At the same time, more people are visual as opposed to auditory learners, and information is taken in better when it's presented visually for these people. Thus, I am sure that the slides also presented the opportunity for visual learners to catch and take in information they would have otherwise missed without the slides.
Having watched the first debate it felt very much like White gave up debating the topic after his opening statement and just started throwing cheap shots after that. Didn’t really feel he even address Jimmy’s idea of how solo script. could be disproven
I have been watching debates for the past couple of months between Catholics vs everyone. What a rich Tradition and depth the Catholic Church has in its knowledge of God. I may never fully understand all of it but my faith has increased in THE church. Raised by a Catholic mother and a Baptist Father. I could never leave the church that has the Authority and Eucharist! Blessed be the name of the Lord!
Very well stated. It seems that our Protestant friends have made a habit of protesting The Catholic Faith without any real knowledge of what they dislike /hate. I believe that Catholics have largely ignored the attacks and are only recently defending the depth, breadth and scope of the Truth.
I’m a former feral RBap, currently high church Anglican, but very sympathetic to Roman Catholic theology. This debate (to me anyway) was one of the most devastating of White’s career. Jimmy really brought out the self-refuting nature of Sola Scriptura and “Faith Alone” as portrayed by Protestants. I’ve learned that most of what I️ think I️ know about the RCC is based on Protestant midcharacterization. Keep up the great work Jimmy! Your work has really expanded my understanding and I️ know I’m not the only one.
Keep listening! Praying for you, brother. 🙏
Please pray for James White who has been taken up in a Texas hospital due to a medical emergency.
Have there been any updates on whats going on?
@@ajamusic7322Jimmy posted a comment on his last video saying it’s not life threatening and soon to be resolved.
Glad to hear that it is nothing too bad... But it is still yucky to be sick away from home, and I pray that he get better soon.
I think he's back home now. It was a large kidney stone apparently. Poor guy, I've heard those are absolutely horrible pain.
@@mewster1818 Yes,I suffered from it ,two yrs ago .Fortunately ,it was resolved by meds,including herbal ,but did have a hospital visit .Its one of those moments that you say to yourself"I would rather die than keep suffering from this pain" . Im glad he is home and okay now .We need him !
Realizing through debates by Jimmy and Trent Horn that sola scriptura was false was the first step in my conversion to catholicism. Glory to Jesus Christ!
Remember, sola scriptura isn't in the scriptura😊
I watched both debates and Akin came across exactly as he said: loving , knowledgeable, approachable, on topic. James came across as if he knew / knows everything-self -righteous, prideful. I was baptized catholic, then became Protestant. After many years, I returned to my Catholic faith. I’m never looking back. ❤Thank you Mr. Akin for your presence at the debate and presenting with LOVE and clear understanding. Towards the end of the 2nd debate, Akin drew conclusions that we Protestants and Catholics have agreements: the Trinity! ❤
Yep, never liked him even when I was a Protestant. There was always just something about him that made me avoid him. I have no hate for the guy, but a little humility could go a long way lol
As a residential painter. It made me proud that jimmy wore our uniform.
Hahahahahah I hought to myself he is dressed like a painter and he isn't painting but he's pulling it off because he is Jimmy Akin
Well he did paint James into a corner more than once.
It makes no sense to reward his overloading by trying to answer any of it. You did the right thing by merely pointing out the tactic.
And use the softer term "Overload" vs Gish Gallop (until it came up again)
The fact that James White kept bring up past debates for people to watch made me think he knew he lost the debate with Jimmy
Very true. The only way Mr. White could have done worse is if our Lord Jesus would have come down from Heaven and said “Hey James, I’ll debate you”
Its because Jimmy's points are so new to this conversation. I have never heard a Catholic admit to many things that (growing up in the Church) I have heard before.
I had the same thought. He seemed to keep advising people to watch other debates of his because he knew he wasn't doing well in this one.
@@Aethelhart more like after 20+ years of debating Roman Catholics, where has this been ever argued from the RCC position.
Great debate, Jimmy you did a very good job of being charitable and professional. You’re my favorite Catholic apologist. God bless you, brother. Keep up the great work.🙏✝️🇻🇦
Appreciate what you do, Jimmy! I'm a recent convert to the church from being a reformed Baptist the past few years. Your content has helped me on this crazy journey!
noah, wecome home, brother :-)
Amen 🙏 ❤
Congrats!! I was raised Reformed Baptist (but from lovely God fearing parents so please don’t think of James white when you think of my family!!), became an Anglican for 20
Years and than joined the Church. It’s so amazing being able to receive the fullness of the faith and our Lord in the Eucharist, isn’t it?!?
James white always overloads in his debates. I wasn’t familiar with those terms but it’s what he does except I would say he does it to gain the support of his audience based on their dislike for the add pms he makes rather than him being able to argue a case in there current debate. It is so unethical and wrong.
Welcome home.
You know you won a debate when your opponent’s first point in his debrief is that you had the wrong cowboy hat and color of pants.
James White does a terrible job putting himself in a sympathetic light. He's also just plain wrong in his viewpoints, so that certainly doesn't help
Your closing statement that pointed out sola Scriptura is a "post-biblical inference" (and that White agreed with that) that phrase really caught my attention. When White, Ortlund, and The Other Paul concede this, they don't even realize how much they've given away. Especially because it undercuts completely any Scripture citations they provide for sola Scriptura. How can one be consistent in quoting Scripture to prove a post biblical inference?
If I'm not mistaken, White has declined to debate you before saying you weren't bringing anything new to the table. It surprised me how offended he seemed to be by your novel angle in the debate
Exactly!
White contradicts himself? Never! 😂
That’s not accurate. AOMin had attempted for years to arrange a debate with Jimmy. Catholic Answers declined. What White actually said was “Why do you want to debate only Sola Scriptura? Why not debate the changes to Roman Catholicism under Pope Francis”. It was Matt Fradd that claimed White refused to debate Akin. I contacted AOMin. And was told that they had heard nothing from Akin nor C.A regarding a desire to debate.
@@PaulLaChapelle Dont waste your time...
@@PaulLaChapelleThere haven't been any changes to Catholicism under Pope Francis, despite what the secular press claims. As my late Dad taught me in my childhood, "The Pope can say that the sky is green and the grass is blue, but Catholics don't have to believe it," because it isn't true. Whatever error Pope Francis believes, it doesn't change Church teaching. The reason White believes that Pope Francis changed Church teaching is because he doesn't understand the role of the Pope (and it's possible that Francis does, too).
I really liked your use of slides!! It helped everyone understand your points more clearly.
Is Jimmy allowed back in Louisiana or is there a warrant out for his arrest for murdering James?
All I'll say is that I got up at 5:30 in the morning and promptly left the state.
Jimmy you're a true gem for the catholic faith. Using a conciliatory approach to "confront" White was genius. White does not really have any logical or historical case against us, rather it's all really just personal with him, such that when you said we agree multiple times he seemed quite peeved. Also he seemed rather uncomfortable talking about faith from a love/charity perspective. I'm glad you hit him on that extensively even though his answers were kinda lame. The moment he starts deflecting with marian dogmas and indulgences etc... that means he can't answer the question. Bravo! Great job! Please debate more. I feel like other catholic apologists lack in centering these debates on love. I'm glad you brought that back into the limelight.
Hopefully James White will someday figure out that he's not going to win debates by means of his snide and off-topic remarks, and his general unpleasantness.
Enjoyed this discussion!!
Jimmy I live 10 min from that church and attend St Margaret’s church just up the road. I’m crushed I wasn’t aware of the debate and would have loved to have attended. Thank you for being a soldier of Christ and defending Holy mother church
My favorite apologist. Jimmy is a significant reason I became Catholic.
Jimmy your amazing! May God always bless you in defending our Catholic faith 🙏🙏
I do love Atkins' conciliatory approach though. It feels more in line with the Lords expectations.
I appreciate Jimmy's style especially in a world where our polemics are all about making our opponents look stupid or painting them as enemies. There is a way to speak and defend the Truth charitably and firmly.
I thought Jimmy's cross-examination on night 2 was devastating. I kept looking around for a referee to stop the fight... great job, Jimmy.
I didn't really get that. I think Akin performed a little better than White in the debate, but not by a very wide margin. Neither really said anything too impactful to drive the conversation forward. Both represented their sides decently well.
Edit:
sorry I just realized I only watched the sola scriptura debate. I don't know which debate night 2 was. I might not have seen it.
@@not_milkJames White did not want to admit it, but he believes in "purgatory." Akin was masterful in his setup.
@@not_milk yeah, no worries. The debates as a whole were fairly even (slight edge to Akin), but the night-two cross-examination was a big dub for Jimmy. You'll have to give it a watch - top shelf stuff.
"Stop it! Just stop it! He's already dead!"
@@matthewstevenson6835 I'm really curious to see that now. Was night 2 the justification one?
I tend toward favoring a middle road between the Catholic and protestant views of justification.
I love how James White’s positions all stem from how HE interprets scripture rather than the institution (the Church) that compiled it under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Every time he brings up a Catholic teaching, it devolves into “because ROME…” as if there’s no biblical basis for the catechism. It’s almost like he believes there’s no distinction between the Roman Empire and the Catholic Church.
This is a common rallying cry among protestants.
James White is a Calvinist and his stated beliefs reflect what John Calvin taught in The Institutes of the Christian Religion, followed by the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith that was composed by Puritan divines who were Calvin's followers in England.
The term Roman Catholic was invented by Protestants, as an insult.
In his mind, there isn't.
@@annakimborahpa Calvin believed in the perpetual virginity of Mary, James white doesn’t.
I actually, as a Protestant, agree with Mr. White -- but in terms of debate, Jimmy won, hands-down.
@@keelyemerine-mix1051 that’s an interesting statement. If Jimmy won then the Catholic point of view is correct. We are all Brothers and sisters who love Christ. There can only be one truth so I hope you at least consider joining the Church started by Jesus and not by Martin Luther. Heaven is easier to reach through the Catholic church
Both the debates and this debrief was enlightening. I look forward to see Jimmy doing more such debates on the other doctrines of the Catholic faith.
Jimmy Akin is the only apologist of any theological persuasion who looks like he could also be in a ZZ Top tribute band.
That is NOT a negative comment against Jimmy. He is a sharp dressed man!
Incidentally, I’m not Catholic, but I did call into Catholic Answers some years ago while Jimmy was hosting. He was very gracious. They sent me his book, “The Drama of Salvation”, which was a good read.
He's got slides, and he knows how to use them.
Never been Akins biggest fan but I was really warmed and impressed by these debates. Thank you.
You did great in these past two debates Jimmy. I'm not usually a huge fan of your style of apologetics but your performances were truly great. Thanks!
Jimmy’s happy go lucky performance showed confidence and I think that made James uncomfortable.
White’s complaint about the slides is really a complaint that Jimmy prepared for the debate. It revealed a lack of preparation on White’s part.
I noted the petty remark made about Jimmy running on 30 seconds during the first round. At that exact moment I had a sense that other nonsensical tactics would be used by White. For example, White referencing the repeated litanies of other debates with other Catholic apologist. Those were failed attempts, arguably egotistical, to inject some gravitas and credibility to his presentation.
Jimmy, you really are amazing. I could only imagine Moses coming down from the mountain with the ten commandments, and the people saying "we don't accept your ten commandments because it is not in our bible"...it's beyond baffling.
Thank you Jimmy for doing the debates
You’re excellent in knowledge and style
A good showing for Catholics
Hi Jimmy, only 30 minutes into this debrief. In case you don't cover this question in the remaining 90 minutes, how did the attendees respond to you at the end of these debates? Given that this was a Baptist Church, I'm wondering if any were persuaded by your excellent arguments.
I really like this comment. I would also like to hear what the crowd thought. I personally feel that most baptist are very friendly so that's what I would expect. (I'm Lutheran)
I also like this comment.
This always happens when a Protestant debates a Catholic. The guidelines of the debate go out the window on the premise that the issues are important to discuss. Bogus, follow the rules.
Happy chuckle of the morning, 43:30:
“What’d you think about the charge of equivocation?”
“I thought it was lame.”
I agree regarding Mr. White's cranky demeanor. It's not a helpful or charitable Christian temperament (and sadly one I deal with myself). I've found this is common amongst reformed Christians I encounter in even casual theological dialogue (I'm a convert from a non reformed protestant background and don't consider myself an apologist). One fellow, still a friend, stated that God is not a loving entity, which I thought was reasonably consistent with his calvinist understanding.
White came form an abusive family
Like Luther did
And both are looking to attack back but to afraid to take it to their parents so they that take it to another authority the Pope and the Catholic Church a lot easier for them. Cowardly
Yeah, Calvinists like to mirror their cold, uncaring "God."
@@MeanBeanComedydamn!
@@hailholyqueen I guess he's called Mean Bean rightly.
Makes me wonder if Richard Dawkins and the New Atheists are cultural Calvinists in particular.
I totally agree reformed Protestants tend to be really harsh and uncharitable. Probably because of their framework of God. I’d be angry too, if I believed God created people solely to go to hell.
Jimmy blew James out of the water. Great Job pray James White realizes Jesus Christ founded only one Church and historically only one Church can be traced back to the Apostles and Jesus Christ.
These debates were great Jimmy!
jimmy you are a treasure!!!! God bless
This is like a master class in debating. Wow, wow, wow….I have already learned so much and I’m only about half way through this!
I noticed the overloading in the debate. You forgot the Alphonsus Liguori quote in the second night. Against Trent Horn he brought up the The Brown Scapular.
♡ Brown Scap!
I'm a protestant that questions some of the doctrine of every different denomination but White just comes off arrogant in these debates. A lot of these issues the catholic church and protestants disagree on don't effect the fundamental teachings of Jesus therefore don't effect salvation. Its not like Catholics are mormon or something 🤣
The church will never be destroyed, even the jew Gamaliel, Saul's mentor said it Acts 5:38-39. That was 2000 years ago!
I disagree.
Baptism, Confession then the Eucharist are pivotal.
Protestants and Catholics do disagree on fundamental teachings. The rejection of these teachings is why protestants are separated from the faith.
@@michaelvilleneuve8292 You got a different definition of fundamental than I do but I know there's people in every denomination of christianity that think every other ones hellhound because they don't agree with say babtism age, Sunday worship.... I got amish neighbors that are basically legalist trying to be "good" and get to heaven. I'm sure are convinced me and you are going to hell🤣
Dear@@michaelvilleneuve8292, @mrbill4187 did say "some." His point is that he agrees that the Church is Christian.
I'll take that! I do get tired of being told that I am automatically going to Hell because I discerned the Catholic Church is the Church Jesus founded and continues to accompany.
Jesus is ALIVE!
When it comes to Sola Scriptura Protestants commit the motte and Bailey fallacy.
What they really believe (the Bailey): Scripture is sufficient to formulate all Christian doctrine and all Christian doctrine must be proved from scripture.
What they pretend they’re really saying (the motte): All we’re saying is Scripture is the only thing that’s infallible.
The Holy Spirit that dwells in Catholic Church since 33AD, which guides her to all truth, dictates and develops dogma and doctrine!!!
That's why, as a Protestant, I prefer the term "Prima Scriptura"
@@darthnocturnis3941 So by prima scriptura you believe that scripture is inerrant and there is a teaching church to guide our understanding of it?
@@janegildart7585 That is more or less what I mean. Scripture is the first and primary source of understanding our faith; but it would be foolish to dismiss the recorded traditions of the early church to which Protestants more less ascribe.
Jimmy! This video clarified more than the debate!
Holy Scripture teaches we must cooperate with God's saving grace and repent and bear fruit and forgive others and love one another and keep the commandments and persevere to the end to be saved! James White says, "not true ".
James White will NEVER admit that his interpretations are Fallible! Ironic!🤔 Jimmy Akin is amazing, humble and brilliant! !Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and Kind God and Savior, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink drink!
Thank you!
"A pair of slides prepared"
Would you say they were pre-paired?
loved the debate , glad that u both agreed to have it.
I just watched the 2 debriefs .. from James W and Jimmy A.
It is striking the difference ... Jimmy wants to do the best possible debate within the bounds of charity and describes a very methododical approach trying to push certain topics and cover all possible rebuttals.
James W appears to have accepted terms he was not sure about and comes across as having done the debate before there is nothing new to argue and he has the stronger argument ... before the debate starts. James fails to see (or acknowledge) that Jimmy A was very astute in doing homework to have slides on many possible rebuttals.
Thanks to both debaters in providing information and putting forward your thoughts on both debates. I dont watch debates to "see" a winner... I watch them to gain knowledge on the topic and learn. I really enjoyed these debates!!
I think it may be hard for some of us older generation to get past the fact that it is disrespectful for a man to wear a hat indoors and especially a church. Big no no regardless of the “look”, but was glad to see the debate for sure.
Well, for one that didn't look like a church. It looks like a conference hall.
For another, Catholics aren't obligated to remove their hat in a non-Catholic Church. This was a Protestant place.
When people comment on the attire of the debater, that’s how you know he won the debate
It's wild to me that James is held in such high regard in some circles when his understandings on certain topics are so off...
Loved the debates and this debrief! Thank you for all your work Jimmy!
Jimmy won because of his cross examination performance
Jimmy, you’re the best!
These conversations are extremely interesting.
Akin you really did a good job in the whole debate, and in the cross examination for Sola Scriptura! I noticed!
You were very precise in your cross-examination and got to the heart of the issue on Sola Scriptura.
Meanwhile, White kept pressing you about the "outgrowth" of a non-Sola Scriptura doctrine, which is the Apostolic Paradigm, in his cross-examination such as the Marian dogma, Indulgences, Fiducia Supplicans, etc., which are honestly, totally irrelevant is what I've noticed.
Those weren't the heart of the issue on your side. The heart was the Apostolic Paradigm, and whether he could prove his case that Sola Scriptura is a thing in Scriptures. He wasn't able to do either of those, as in provide evidence that the Apostolic Tradition isn't real, based on his definition, and Sola Scriptura being in the function of Scriptures itself, and instead just tried to paint the Catholic Church as bad because it's outgrowth is not Sola Scriptura, which doesn't matter because the Catholic Church does not subscribe to that doctrine. He had to prove first that Sola Scriptura is the only legitimate infallible authority which he did not.
Also, I don't think you brought this out explicitly, probably because of the time limit, but you were able to implicate from White that his point about "You can't have Sola Scriptura, without Scriptura", could not be possible in the Early Church history, because the canon of NT scriptures were not yet established (by repeatedly pointing to the death of the Apostles). So how could he Sola Scriptura, without Scriptura to base on? Hence, there had to be an infallible authority outside of scriptures to determine the course of the Church, and even which canon to consider. I got that impression as you cross-examined him which was really amazing!
I also learned a few things about our Church that I didn't know thanks to that debate. I knew that whatever the Pope says on the media isn't all infallible, but I didn't know that it is also the case with Church documents. I didn't know there was a specific criteria to it to determine infallibility. Thank you on that!
Great debate. But since the topic came up, I think Jimmy needs a makeover, maybe take a foot off the beard? That way he could look great with a bolo tie, maybe a vest and large beltbuckle and some rhinestones here and there. James White’s beard also needs a good trimming. Akin’s attitude was great, while White did come across as someone who sees himself as an authority, when all he is is a self appointed freelance Bible interpreter presenting his opinion. Akin simply presented the teachings of the Church.
Hi Mr. Akin! I remember thinking to myself during your first rebuttal in the first debate, "How does he have a slide addressing exactly what Mr. White had brought up only few moments before"? I thought your slides fit perfectly in the rebuttal rounds. Very very cool. You are the best.
Also, if you could choose one catholic apologist to defend the faith alongside you, who would you choose?
Rad Trad Jimmy doesn't exist, he can't hurt you.
Rad Trad Jimmy: 1:14:08
thank you for the fantastic debrief!
Awesome work Jimmy!!
Smoking that pipe like a boss... ❤❤❤ way to go Jimmy!!!
Smoking my pipe while listening to this 😊
Love Jimmy Akin!
Jimmy has great style on that debate stage!
Thanks Jimmy Akin, very cool!
I think James White’ thought process is something like this: the non sola scriptura side can’t explain the pope , Mary etc… and Jimmy hasn’t explained it; ergo sola scriptural side is the e way to go.
The problem of course being that there's plenty of explanatory power, he just rejects it.
The sola scriptura side can’t explain the sola scriptura side. 😊
I've wondered why Jimmy did'nt expand when Mr. White commented on 2 Thes.2:15 that what St. Paul meant is that the tradition already received by the Thesalonians is the Gospel which is self refuting. I mean the first of letters of Paul is these Letters to Thesalonians. So does St. Paul imparted orally the Gospel according to, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John? how about the letter of Peter, James, etc, etc.
Ergo, James whit needs to accept the authority of the Catholic Church
I've never met James White. I have seen him debate many times, against many people. I really dislike his tactics, many of his deflections and arguments. I see him as a fundamentally dishonest actor in the theological realm, unable to listen and learn from others. I don't like that. Also, White often displays anger, hostility, meanness and nastiness. I don't like that either. I think this mainly happens when he is confronted with the weakness, or falsity of his own arguments, and he has no comeback.
James White has always struck me as an egocentric bully, who debates because he can stroke his ego and belittle his opponent at the same time.
❤All glory to God for having you Akin
Mr. Akin- married to a unreasonable Protestant wife, Ive learned a lot from you as the best way to evangelize to her... unfortunately I'm married to a James White type-
Prayed for her
Hi Jimmy. Good job on the debates.
You might want to edit the title for this debriefing video. "Justification". Will help for future when people search for this. Cheerio.
Honestly, I thought James White was less than gracious. It felt like he wasn’t there to debate the topics, but rather to attack an enemy. I think the “wrong color” cowboy hat comment meant Jimmy should have been wearing a black cowboy hat, like the bad guys in Western movies. That seemed indicative of James Whites mindset, and that he thinks everyone is on his side while fighting the Catholic enemy.
I particularly enjoyed the new content Jimmy Aiken brought to the debate. Completely caught White off guard and all he could do was cry “not fair” when he couldn’t use his canned rebuttals.
Masterfully done Mr. Aiken.
Great job Aikin
Jimmy was being nice by say Mr. White is consistent. In James said it was weird that Jimmy had slides for his rebuttals. Another word is better describing him would be predictable.
Jimmy, I’d love to hear from you. I was Protestant for 38 years, my entire life. I began feel an urge to turn to the Catholic Church and began listening to you. It’s transformed my life, I’m currently looking into converting. I have a question I’d love to hear you speak on. As a former Baptist from the Bible Belt, I
Knew very few Calvinist. Most Baptist I know of don’t even agree with their beliefs. But when I watch debates all I see is the Calvinist position being approached like it’s the standard for Protestantism. Isn’t it true that Calvinist are a small minority in the religious community that no one agrees with? Why are they seen as the standard for protestantism during these theology discussions? Doesn’t it matter than their view is so small it should be highlighted? I never see this brought up.
I have had false statements thrust upon me by Protestants, out of the blue, about "facts" purported to be true. Each time, further discussion revealed that the false information was obtained, in church, from their minister. I don't know why they don't simply mind their own business. I have been Catholic for 69 years and never, not once, heard a Priest, or educator, talk about any perceived fallacies of Protestantism. This includes 16 years of Catholic education ranging from first grade through a college, with an associated seminary. I simply wish Protestantism would transcend from being in part an active verb to be only a noun. That, is quit protesting and move on.
Catholics live in their minds rent-free
Love your ministry. Keep up the great work. ❤
I was hoping you'd do this!
Love Jimmy's style of debate and dress👍
The funniest part of the first debate was James White deridingly pointing out how Jimmy somehow had a slide for every one of his rebuttals, as if that was somehow a bad thing for Jimmy.
Hey jimmy…. I love this content ive learned so much. Ive fallen prey to overload many times and have learned to avoid it by staying on topic through sheer trial and error. I think a van diagram might be helpful to show opponents in the future how apostolic tradition can be but isnt limited to the gospel. Same goes with scripture, oral preaching, god’s word, and tradition. I wonder if it can be done im trying to imagine it. I think it could be helpful in my debates, im always hit with the “define the gospel” trap where if i say too little or too much its outside of the gospel or under defines it. These days i just say “”you go first” and pull the same trick on them, i find it an unsatisfactory way of handling the question.
If Jimmy sees this, I have a question. I am wondering about the conception of time between Protestants and Catholics. It seems as if Protestants (Calvinists in particular) seem to take a God-like view of time and try to see past, present, and future as one, even though we live in time. James referred to the "already not yet" in the debate. This would explain their understanding of justification as being life-long, as well as the notion of predestination as being one with the elect and the reprobate. But Catholics understand that, because we live in time, God applies grace and forgiveness - in other words, the finished work of the cross as being ongoing - to us in time. Might this distinction get at the heart of our disagreements on this matter?
That’s basically the difference yes
You did excellent, Jimmy!
Thanks for this. It really smoothed out some questions I had about the debates.
Probably the most important criticism I've heard regards Jimmy Akin having different viewpoints than other Catholics on the topic of justification.
I was so glad that Jimmy referenced the 1999 "Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification."
Totally Orthodox Catholic Teaching, but in terms that some people are not familiar with.
Rather than other viewpoints, he used a different language that is more conciliatory to protestants.
Jimmy definitely got under James White's skin. It showed when James White petulantly complained that Jimmy had gone 30 seconds over on his presentation.
The problem was that I was in the middle of reading a chart at the end of my opening statement, and failing to read the back half of the chart would have just been super-disorienting. But 30 seconds is only 30 seconds, and I'm happy for balance. That's why I told White if he wanted another 30 seconds, I had his back.
@JimmyAkin How petty of him, 30 secs, that's all... He spent 30 secs complaining about it.. You were getting under this skin.
Never thought I'd hear algorithm in the context of debating.
"I'm psychic!" is a savage way of telling White he's that predictable 😂
One of my fav people I’ve never met ! My mans Jimmy!
Jimmy A.: "The Church's approach for decades has been to look for common ground on this." This is really funny. There is no Deposit of the Faith if you think the last few decades determinative of anything. We have a 2000-year old Deposit. I do find that Jimmy often goes overboard toward protestantism. I realize he is a convert from protestantism, and I have usually let it slide because, I say to myself, "he just doesn't have those Catholic bones." But I find it a red flag that he thinks he's putting it better than Mitch Pacwa, Patrick Madrid, et al. When you set up to speak for Catholicism, don't stab us in the back: This faith alone/ not alone problem is real such that it divided all of Christiendom, and to soft pedal what is at stake is not helpful. The true Faith is that we are saved by grace through faith lived out in love. All Of That. Protestantism refuses to admit this obvious scriptural reality, and pretending we can say, very carefully and very conditionally, that we are saved by faith alone, is simply unhelpful. I expect Mr. A. scoffs at verbiage from before the last few decades such as "Treasury of Merit," but I've been a Catholic for a lot longer than he has, in a long line of Catholics all well -formed, and there is true, as the Catholic Church has done for eons, that we can help merit in and with Christ, our own salvation--carefully and conditionally understood. That is the teaching that needs to be carefully understood, not "faith alone". Our apologists need to defend not jettison the classic, customary ways in which Catholicism has habituated her children. That said, I thoroughly enjoyed the debate and appreciated all the beautiful and careful defending of the Faith that Mr. Akin did. I loved the slides and took notes! He is a gentleman and a kind scholar.
Sometimes Catholics are too ecumenical towards Protestants & others quite frankly. It's a bit of a tightrope because you want to invite people in but you also can't compromise and appeal to non-Catholic beliefs
That's a long way to say "I don't like the way you do apologetics". Because that's all there is here. You didn't prove Jimmy put forth an error (because he didn't) and you didn't prove alternative ways to frame the disagreement are more or less helpful than the way Jimmy chose to approach it.
@@tafazziReadChannelDescription There is no Deposit of the Faith if you think the last few decades determinative of anything
@@pmlm1571 The Deposit of Faith is here, and strong! Look at the church's recent authoritative interpretation of the Deposit of Faith which allows her to disprove transgender ideology.
@@pmlm1571agreed
Great discussion!
Here is a comment for you Jimmy! Keep up the great work!
Amazing Jimmy Akin, well preparing to the war.
Salute to you Sir
I've wondered why Jimmy did'nt expand when Mr. White commented on 2 Thes.2:15 that what St. Paul meant is that the tradition already received by the Thesalonians is the Gospel which is self refuting. I mean the first of letters of Paul is these Letters to Thesalonians. So does St. Paul imparted orally the Gospel according to, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John? how about the letter of Peter, James, etc, etc. Therefore, he still need to accept the Authority of the Catholic Church with regards to his position.
Thank you for all that you do Jimmy!
When are you coming up to Alaska?? 🤣
Jimmy Akin is a Boss!
You should have asked White if he agrees with Pope Benedict that 2+2 = 4... he may have disagreed
Jimmy, I know you’re trying to disarm your opponent when you clap for them, or clap for the audience, such as “congratulations you’re not anathema!”, but it comes off rather patronizing. This said, you dominate these debates.
Yeah I agree. I think it would be fine and funny if he just said congrats you’re not anathema, but no need to make the audience clap.
Yes, I completely agree. I think your humor and personableness come out with it as well as the point you are making in a much better way (with verbalizing but not clapping). Small point. So thankful for you fighting for the truth. And doing it so well and so charitably, brother.
I think in his Ehrman debate it came off as lest patronizing than with James White. I am not sure why. I think if Jimmy just left out the clapping it would be great.
@@shlamallama6433 I wonder if it's because Bart Ehrman is less confrontational.
one point I'd like to see someone make to White, or any Reformed apologist, is that the idea of "imputing" righteousness to us is the basis for merits and the treasury of saints - God imputes the rewards of X to Y, and Y builds up on that to further his own righteousness
At the heart of Jimmy's use of slides is the idea that White's arguments were so predictable, as Jimmy noted here. Jimmy had a slide prepared to accompany a rebuttal to essentially any central claim White would likely make. At the same time, more people are visual as opposed to auditory learners, and information is taken in better when it's presented visually for these people. Thus, I am sure that the slides also presented the opportunity for visual learners to catch and take in information they would have otherwise missed without the slides.
Having watched the first debate it felt very much like White gave up debating the topic after his opening statement and just started throwing cheap shots after that. Didn’t really feel he even address Jimmy’s idea of how solo script. could be disproven