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Obviously being 300 years before Christ Plato did not consider a citizenry empowered by love. Then true Democracy can flourish. Plato was 3000 years ago by the end of the Aquarian age this will all be in place.
First time I am seeing this comment. Sacrificing money from CZcams " partner" program *for a principal.* The vast majority won't understand what I am saying. But I am certain you do. 😆 I accidentally stumbled upon "The Life Academy ". .. Wish I had much earlier. Thank You. 🙏🙏
Democracy is global equality Republic is independent liberty "The ideal of a constitutional republic is individual liberty. In this century, great strides have been made toward the goal of subverting our republic and transforming it into a democracy. The foremost tactic of the subverters is the subversion of “language” - by calling America a democracy, until people thoughtlessly accept the term and use the term. Totalitarians have obscured the real meanings and principles of the American government.” Dan Smoot.
Yes … and it was 2400 years ago this discussion on how democratic government systems will alway have a life expectancy before it implodes and for his wisdom they killed him. The very first democrats killed Socrates! And have been brainless idiots since
I remember going down my own road of realization and going 'why the hell did I think democracy was always a positive thing?' Then I remembered I lived in a republic and answered my own question.
2400 years ago. Who said that 2 or 3000 years ago people were not civilized? What means civilized? The rich man? The starving man? The construction of cars, machinery means civilization? Lets start from the basics....What civilization is?
Plato believed that the best form of government was one that was based on justice and that promoted the common good, and he believed that democracy, like all other forms of government, had the potential to be unjust. Plato was particularly critical of what he saw as the excesses of democracy, such as the tendency of the majority to trample the rights of the minority. However, Plato also recognized the value of democracy as a form of government that gives all citizens a voice in the decision-making process. In the end, Plato's view of democracy was nuanced and complex, and he saw it as having both positive and negative aspects.
The idea that democracy=good is simply a modern way of thinking. Throughout history democracy has been overall reviled until the 20th, even the founding fathers of the american revolution openly disliking it and making as many failsafes in their republican model so as to not fail. Im highly critical of democracy overall, thinking its a system utilized by sociopaths and con artists to amass power, yet I do think it does work in smaller scaled areas. A city tends to be as big as you'd want a democracy to be. A country of 5 million is too big to be ran democratically, 50 million impossible and any larger just a futile endeavor. Even with the hypothetical scenario that if all citizens were equally edicated on the subjects is impossible as well as the fact that I find it personally unethical to force that onto a population.
Thank you for this video. I am using this as my reference for my upcoming thesis proposal. My topic is about the problem of democratic form of government.
Thus video is shit .... the video below explains WHY democracy does not work and Machiavelli's Discourse on Livy explains WHY a Republic works better than Democracy. czcams.com/video/fLJBzhcSWTk/video.html
Eccellente choice of topic Saul! Too many people know not what they speak of when using the word democracy and the understanding of the democratic government system
@@pragyanr.c9477 yea but the party he's affiliated with is not good. They have hundreds of leaders "who haven't overcome personal greed", "who don't care about universal education", and are discriminatory. 9:27
I hope this was of help to you. Most greek philosophers (the likes of Socrates, Plato and Aristotle) had some good arguments against democracy. Maybe a quick search could help you here. Regardless, have a great presentation 🙌
I am an indian. And democracy sucks here. To take any decision , it takes 50 years here. You can take decision only when there is a majority party. Decision making process is always hindered by opposition for the sake of appeasement of their vote banks. Communist china has lifted 300 millions people out of poverty. India has pushed 100 millions into poverty. Only idiots become leaders in democracy. An average person has idea about country economy, foreign policy, etc. They votes on the basis of emotions and appeasement. Plato has said more about this
@@MrKeyman2002 if you can write anything means you will write anything. Why are you are being a proponent of democracy, when dont anything about it. America adopted democracy when whole world was in turmoil. It has became formidable way before others. In today's time, especially for developing countries, democracy is not best option rather slowest option. Mixed democracy or technocracy is better than sole democracy.
"One of the biggest blessings of human existence is that we can use the gift of imagination to think of a better world" ✨ Heyy Tanmay, I'm glad to see you're back!! 😊 Plato was indeed a wise man and I find it so fascinating that even after more than 2000 years, his words are still of value. Democracy definitely has its flaws, so thank you for making a video about it. Keep going!! 💛
It almost makes you want to cry to imagine this sort of world. You look at the US, one of the world's foremost democracies, and the one that certainly gets the most scrutiny, and see how all of these failings have, not necessarily ruined it, but made governance inefficient and corrupt. Such that the needs of the very very few seem to always outweigh those of the masses.
We have enough trouble agreeing on educational syllabuses let alone entry standards for politicians. Today we can't set standards for politicians because those very standards can, and would, be manipulated towards particular ideologies. Imagine the intense differences of opinion in deciding whether a person has performed "well" in a lower office or not.
The reason why democracy is failing in the Unite States is because the electorate is no longer educated. Democracy is only the best system when the voters are educated and capable of critical thinking. I''m not sure logic, civics and history are seriously taught in school anymore; hence, the decline of democracy. Recently, I heard a young person disparage democracy as "the dictatorship of the majority." That's probably something he heard and that was all he knew about it. That is why I am pessimistic about the future of this country.
Wealthy countries always develop into people who would rather vote for a living than work for one. You can never become a rich and powerful nation without the great equalizer of politicians and their hoards of uneducated voters who come to take it over.
Socrates was right. We need a high academic bady which independently tests and evaluates all candidates for presidency. They should be tested on cognitive skills, critical thinking, humanities education, philosophy, and science education. Without these prerequisites NO ONE should be allowed to run for a chance at ruling the nation. Too much is at stake
One must follow this video for two reasons. The first reason is to see if worth for someone to loose some time to see it. For sure, that is excellent and very useful for many people. Then, one should check the comments and see how it affects to different people. Well, for some is very useful. For some others, seems that you can not teach someone something that he thinks he knows it already.
The Core of the problem is the lack of common Interpretation of life. You have the materialists who believe that materia is everything there is and who don’t accept or even tolerate a beyond. Then you have plenty of people who don’t even care about the existence or absence of any meaning, who numb them selfes with material goods and constant entertainment. And you have the various different spiritual outlooks who hope in an afterlife, Act according to their revelation or codex or act as complete hipocrites. Now, only the fact that you, as an individual, are every day confronted with completely different outlooks on what life actually is, wears your System down and creates a constant or even evergrowing anger towards society. This will increase over decades to come. You are mocking the religious wars in Europe in the 17th century where fundamental views collided with each other. Then have a look at what hysteria we are heading towards: Aggression between black and white, car drivers vs bycicle drivers, animal lovers vs meat eaters, heterosexuals vs homosexuals, trans people vs everybody, left vs right (without the people actually knowing where the terms come from and what they mean). What they call progressive Society will slowly cannibalize itself, and. It will hurt. These things were recognized by Platon over 2000 years ago, even when democracy was not yet liberal and was restricted to a handfull of men with similar lifestyle, similar believes and probably way more resilience than modern men
IF people are smart enough, there wouldn't be an actual rift when it comes to preferences, unfortunately people let emotions run their actions and speech over logic and common sense.
@@zaberfang yes, because they are emotional beings. Reasoning is good but of people get the slightest idea of getting treated unjustly they breed hatred. Not over a day, a week, or even a year. But If this goes over years and even decades…
Plato`s "solution" to the problems of Democracy was Autocratic Rule by those who "Know". That those who have the true philosophical knowledge of how things really are. The ideal result for Plato would be a rigid, stultifiling autocracy that was ideally nearly totally unchanging because of Plato's almost pathological hatred of change. Thus Plato's idea of an ideal society was one in which an Elite ruled with near absolute power over people, in which dissent was crushed and everything was static. Thus in the Republic we have the "Noble Lies" told by the Elite to justify their autocratic rule and "Justice" is everyone doing what they are best fitted for has determined by this Elite and "Justice" has fair treatment is not even considered. And of course Plato's idea that "unequals" being treated has "equals" is unjust is little more than a thinly veiled appeal to the notion that certain people are entitled to more power and priviliges than others including the right to treat others badly. In Plato's dialogue The Statesman we have an unapologetic celebration of the idea of the Autocrat not bounded by Law with a bogus philisophical justification. In Plato's Laws we have censorship, sealing society has much has possible from outside influence, thought control and in the Nocturnal Council an inquisition. Plato's solution to the problems of democracy was autocracy and what would amount to coercion, tyranny and terror. Plato's deep dislike of Democracy was born quite simply out of disgust at the idea that the "unwashed", the "Mob" etc., would hve any say in governing themselves when that "right" belonged in Plato's eyes i nthe hands of a sdmall oligarchic Elite. Then given Plato's Aristocratic background this was a natural belief. Like so many of the Athenian Upper Class Oligarchic sympathizers he believed the Elite, (Meaning others like them.), deserved to rule and like them the masses shouls be obedient to their "betters". Plato was basically a philosophical snob. During his lifetime oligarchic attempts were made to destroy the Athenian Democracy most horribly during the period of the so-called Thirty Tyrants in which Thousands of Athenian Citizens and others were murdered by the tyrants. Among them was the man Critias a relative of Plato who was apparantly the most vicious of the lot and a pupil of Socrates like Plato. In his Dialogues Plato has Critias appear has one of his characters and gives him a positive spin. It appears that for Plato the death of Socrates forever marred and damned Athenian Democracy but the various bloody Oligarchic coups and bloody rule did not taint Oligarchic rule by those who like Critias "knew". I have little doubt that any attempt by Plato to impose his solutions on Athens or any where else would have resulted in mass atrocity.
A nation needs a volunteer army to protect itself from outside threats while it remains an anarchy on the inside since all governments eventually fail.
A few people who aren’t very smart collect all the money at the expense of the citizens lives. It’s a chosen act of neglecting the population. You said it right, keeping power and money.
How can we move forward according to Plato. Racism, fascism, separation wit in a multicultural society. When they keep society divided. Now humanity is living in a world of uncertainty
As a Brazilian, i'm pretty sure things are way more chaotic here than they are in swaziland, bhutan, finland or iceland. Freedom of association is not a bad thing.
PLATO FOR PRESIDENT he's right they should have some education or time in the political arena before they run for government some experience thank you for the excellent video and have a good evening 😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊.
All Plato, is saying, as far as I'm concerned, is to "put only people who aren't corrupt, in positions of power. Which, actually, strikes me as a bit naively lame for such a highly intelligent man. He doesn't give enough safe-guards to account for the flaws, he obviously is aware of, in human nature. Most notably, "corruption." 😎🇺🇸
Democracy is the power of the Demos. The Demos in the ancient Greek City States had about 10 to 15000 citizens. There is no Demos with millions of citizens. This is a fairy tale. To understand how Democracy works and capitalism, stick to the Spartans and learn.(best before the Ephors took over power)
Your commentary is brilliant and the work you're doing is vitally important. If humans don't soon figure out why our so-called 'Civilization' has utterly failed and design a new post-political Governance System for everyone, it will collapse and disappear. Thank you, looking forward to more.
As long as we are required or insist that we live together in communities called towns and cities where it is beneficial to pool resources like land, water, food, shelter and labour; governance (agreements/disagreements) is inevitable. Two individuals can agree, share and rely most of the time. Three or more individuals will need some form of governance (rules). Those who can never agree; well just look around. As a species, we have not evolved where we recognize and respect boundaries. We still want to move in this world as if there are no consequences to complete freedom to exploit, manipulate, coerce, steal and expunge an unhealthy need to worship at our own feet.
Well! History repeats itself. They obviously had Trumpers back then too. I totally agree with Socrates then plato that you cannot let ignorance dictate who gets elected, it's recipe for disaster. Either limit who votes or prepare your population with a better education system.
British democracy has evolved in a two party state that apart from the odd coalition have run the country for over a hundred years,that is to mean Tory and labour.
I find none of the ideals you've mentioned here unreasonable therefore none of them are overly idealistic or un realistic. Can we possibly function as a society if we are in any way unable to cope with reason and reality?
What form of government does work? Someone tell me that! Anyway the video confuses democracy with rights. Democracy as we know it is a system by means of which a government is elected. Rights are an innovation of liberalism - equal opportunity, freedom of movement, freedom of the press, free speech etc. Hence the term liberal democracy, so different from the Athenian democracy of ancient times.
My perception: Plato was not against Democracy but against Sub-optimal democracy which is Partial, Partisian and Political. Merit based and Rational rule is desirable be it any form of Government. Democracy doesnt guarantee Growth. ( example African Nations) Growth is not only limited to Democratic countries ( Ex. China model although it is facing difficulties now OR Middle eastern countries like UAE).
If we did not have government human kind would never extend beyond Tribes and small groups. For no two groups will have a similar point of view and would only work together when survival demands it. Then when things are going well conflict starts up again. Government is essential to a nation or state to survive beyond survival situations
Plato was an idealist. It does not work. Even if you find a wise leader (and nobody is that wise), he/she would not be able to implement the good ideas. Power corrupts, so even if somebody entered an office with good intentions, he/she rather quickly becomes corrupt. There are good individuals in the world. But once they start to aggregate in groups they revert to being just animals. Read about the psychology of the masses. It is just impossible. But it’s a nice dream to strive towards. May you succeed where others failed.
I don't follow. Plato realizes that politicians should focus on their profession instead of their gain. Okay. And the proposed solution is providing everyone with equal opportunity to education to raise the best suited individuals into power? Something is missing here. If corruption is a psychological problem with people having too much power, wouldn't it affect all candidates the same way regardless of their educational qualification? This seems like wishful thinking.
Because liberal democracies accepts the riff-raf off the streets, sometimes even after they have served 20 years in prison and obtained a degree through self-education, it permits them to compete with the sophisticated and articulate products of human nurture who ought to be making the decisions in the first place.
I think Michael Malice might have some words to say about the beginning. Pfffft, central authority corruption is necessary. HA! I'm going classic anarchist and leftist here, burn it all down. Plato reasoned some things correctly, but listen to what Ayn Rand recommended. Learn about Aristotle.
I believe you may be confused if you’re calling yourself a leftist and then recommending Ayn Rand shortly afterwards. Ayn Rand has been described as “the ultimate gateway drug to the right” by Historian Jennifer Burns. Ayn Rand pushes neo-liberal ideas which are centre-right at best, you could call her an-cap
@@MrHardeep95 listen to some Michael Malice or read Anarchist Handbook. Antifa is an example, according to Michael Malice, of classical anarchist thought. Socialism and anarchism were very similar in thought in the 1800s or when it kinda started being spread about beyond one or two people. At least the Anarcho socialist types. And Ayn Rand ain't a anarchist. She thought anarchism was quite infantile, or at least in denial of the need, even minute, of some central authority to not command and control but to be more like a referee. Ayn Rand hates conservatives. The same reasons reasonable people and leftists do too. All their faults. They have a strong ass tendency to not want to change in any god damn way. And they'll resort to dominance to get you to follow. Reasoning is off the table. Really though, conservatives and modern day liberals have a lot in common. They tap into the same impulses or instincts. The conservatives just don't have enough support cause their reputation has been ruined over the centuries, so they've lost their balls. But we all got left and right in us. That's why I said the leftist in me.
Technically, we don't know anything about the real Socrates. He didn't leave behind any written works of his own and thus, all we know of him is through the lens of his supporters/critics. An example of that is Plato, a student of Socrates. Plato presented many ideas of his own through the character of Socrates that he used in his works but in the present day you can easily find these ideas attributed to Socrates. So to believe our perspective of Socrates is correct, we'd have to assume that anybody that knew Socrates and has written about him, Plato being one of them, is telling the truth and being accurate in their description.
Don't you think that natural laws was a good enough? Human self important making laws that demeaning human. If natural laws was as bad as human laws then human can not be this advance
Plato's argument against a democratic system is born from his support in an autocratic system and autocracy can only be born with force. Plato was not a humanitarian, he was an elitist autocrat.
Being a humanist isn't any better. The decline of the West is proof of this. Seeing as how "humanist" always put "science" over everything else, knowing the principles thereof are just as faulty and imperfect as any other system that exists.
We don't need governments. That's your first error. Why should I be ruled by people I share nothing in common with, simply because we live on the same piece of land. Its nonsensical.
Because a group of people living together would inevitably lead to some form of administration to run things smoothly, otherwise who would regulate price value when you trade with someone else? Who would organise defenses against other groups of people from other lands? If you trespass or kill someone, who is going to hold you accountable? As well as many other things. The state of no government can only work if you live alone, otherwise it is inevitable.
@@baishihua Who would school your children, who would provide food and clothing, who would provide insurances of any kind or health care, who would take care of agriculture, who would take care of recycling. All of these services are provided by private institutions. In countries like South Africa, people rely on private security even low and middle income people for safety. The goverment is not necessary for ever facet of human society and cooperation. They're slow, expensive and unaccountable.
China is well governed after all. I have seen this democracy in Africa where merit is the last thing people consider when voting for president- in Africa it's all about tribe
Oh well! Let's see 🤔The total running length of the video is 10 minutes and 19 seconds. The 'equality' stuff is less than a minute. I wouldn't necessarily call that "crying for equality".
@@TheLifeAcademySN it's the last part people remember the most. The "equality" crap does NOT support argument that excessive Democracy leads to tryanny. Last part sounds like liberals promoting "equality" to make Democracy work. NOT!
Plato's view of demcracy is applicable only to a State which has one religion one culture and oneclass.Inclusive democracy of multi lingual cultural and castes is the only form of democracy ,is the need of present time , for the development of humanity.
Not helpful for the modern world at all. At the time of Plato, one would learn all the knowledge available to humans in 5 years or so with á handfull of long-bearded tutors (that is what all princes and kings in waiting used to do, plus learning to fight)...that is what he means when he says they should be trained for the job. Today, no single person can be "trained for the job", and we need to rely on a large body of advisors and technocrats and think-thanks and so on....and politicians are there to decide about what cannot be answered from a book. For example, experts tell us if we build a housing project near the subway station it will be good for the economy of the neighborhood, but if building that project requires demolishing a park, then whether we should do it or not is not a type of question you can find a scietifically trained expert for. This is now the realm of politics.
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"Envy rots the bones" Proverbs 14: 30
Obviously being 300 years before Christ Plato did not consider a citizenry empowered by love. Then true Democracy can flourish. Plato was 3000 years ago by the end of the Aquarian age this will all be in place.
❤❤❤
First time I am seeing this comment. Sacrificing money from CZcams " partner" program *for a principal.*
The vast majority won't understand what I am saying. But I am certain you do. 😆
I accidentally stumbled upon "The Life Academy ". .. Wish I had much earlier.
Thank You. 🙏🙏
Did you find any "Professor of Social Science" to provide a complete and accurate Definition of concept: Democracy?!
Democracy is global equality
Republic is independent liberty
"The ideal of a constitutional republic is individual liberty. In this century, great strides have been made toward the goal of subverting our republic and transforming it into a democracy. The foremost tactic of the subverters is the subversion of “language” - by calling America a democracy, until people thoughtlessly accept the term and use the term. Totalitarians have obscured the real meanings and principles of the American government.”
Dan Smoot.
I just realised Plato and Socrates already knew 2000 years ago what i just derived my conclusion about democracy.
Yes … and it was 2400 years ago this discussion on how democratic government systems will alway have a life expectancy before it implodes and for his wisdom they killed him. The very first democrats killed Socrates! And have been brainless idiots since
I remember going down my own road of realization and going 'why the hell did I think democracy was always a positive thing?' Then I remembered I lived in a republic and answered my own question.
2400 years ago. Who said that 2 or 3000 years ago people were not civilized? What means civilized? The rich man? The starving man? The construction of cars, machinery means civilization? Lets start from the basics....What civilization is?
But they weren't illiterate...
@@AapVanDieKaap many scientists in ancient times also we're not illiterate. The fact remains, they were wrong
Plato believed that the best form of government was one that was based on justice and that promoted the common good, and he believed that democracy, like all other forms of government, had the potential to be unjust. Plato was particularly critical of what he saw as the excesses of democracy, such as the tendency of the majority to trample the rights of the minority. However, Plato also recognized the value of democracy as a form of government that gives all citizens a voice in the decision-making process. In the end, Plato's view of democracy was nuanced and complex, and he saw it as having both positive and negative aspects.
Are you a bot or a human being that decided to use chat gpt to write a comment?
Plato's Ideal State summary can't be better described as this. Highly appreciate your work!
The idea that democracy=good is simply a modern way of thinking. Throughout history democracy has been overall reviled until the 20th, even the founding fathers of the american revolution openly disliking it and making as many failsafes in their republican model so as to not fail.
Im highly critical of democracy overall, thinking its a system utilized by sociopaths and con artists to amass power, yet I do think it does work in smaller scaled areas. A city tends to be as big as you'd want a democracy to be. A country of 5 million is too big to be ran democratically, 50 million impossible and any larger just a futile endeavor.
Even with the hypothetical scenario that if all citizens were equally edicated on the subjects is impossible as well as the fact that I find it personally unethical to force that onto a population.
Plato: a giant among men. A human that contributed thoughtful ideas to the world.
Very awesome video! I'm surprised how litttle people have watched this. Keep up with the great work!
For sure! Glad you enjoyed it. Spread the word if you may 🙌💯
Thank you for this video. I am using this as my reference for my upcoming thesis proposal. My topic is about the problem of democratic form of government.
Glad this was of help to you! Hope your proposal went/goes well 🙌
Thus video is shit .... the video below explains WHY democracy does not work and Machiavelli's Discourse on Livy explains WHY a Republic works better than Democracy.
czcams.com/video/fLJBzhcSWTk/video.html
Eccellente choice of topic Saul! Too many people know not what they speak of when using the word democracy and the understanding of the democratic government system
Plato also believed that philosophers should also rule countries because of their wisdom.
Sure did!
And he was right.
Modi is a philosopher and he's doing good so far. Not bad.
@@pragyanr.c9477 yea but the party he's affiliated with is not good. They have hundreds of leaders "who haven't overcome personal greed", "who don't care about universal education", and are discriminatory. 9:27
That’s the same thing I was thinking about for years, I guess me and Plato have the same mindset
“Democracy is born from Tyranny.”
-Plato
No I think his version from republic states tyranny is born from democracy. Demagoguery creates an environment for a dictator to take power
None of these ideas are idealistic. We should be striving for this worldwide.
Thank you ! I have a prsentation for my Frwnch class and I have to defend why demcoracy is wrong
I hope this was of help to you. Most greek philosophers (the likes of Socrates, Plato and Aristotle) had some good arguments against democracy. Maybe a quick search could help you here. Regardless, have a great presentation 🙌
@@TheLifeAcademySN thanks !
I am an indian. And democracy sucks here. To take any decision , it takes 50 years here. You can take decision only when there is a majority party. Decision making process is always hindered by opposition for the sake of appeasement of their vote banks. Communist china has lifted 300 millions people out of poverty. India has pushed 100 millions into poverty. Only idiots become leaders in democracy. An average person has idea about country economy, foreign policy, etc. They votes on the basis of emotions and appeasement. Plato has said more about this
@@MrKeyman2002 if you can write anything means you will write anything. Why are you are being a proponent of democracy, when dont anything about it. America adopted democracy when whole world was in turmoil. It has became formidable way before others. In today's time, especially for developing countries, democracy is not best option rather slowest option. Mixed democracy or technocracy is better than sole democracy.
@@MrKeyman2002 i am against sole democracy
Thank you for the excellent work!
Lucid explanation & lovely graphics!!
Thank you for the appreciation! 🙌
"One of the biggest blessings of human existence is that we can use the gift of imagination to think of a better world" ✨
Heyy Tanmay, I'm glad to see you're back!! 😊 Plato was indeed a wise man and I find it so fascinating that even after more than 2000 years, his words are still of value. Democracy definitely has its flaws, so thank you for making a video about it. Keep going!! 💛
You're most certainly right! Thank you for the taking the time to watch 🙌💙
It almost makes you want to cry to imagine this sort of world. You look at the US, one of the world's foremost democracies, and the one that certainly gets the most scrutiny, and see how all of these failings have, not necessarily ruined it, but made governance inefficient and corrupt. Such that the needs of the very very few seem to always outweigh those of the masses.
We have enough trouble agreeing on educational syllabuses let alone entry standards for politicians.
Today we can't set standards for politicians because those very standards can, and would, be manipulated towards particular ideologies. Imagine the intense differences of opinion in deciding whether a person has performed "well" in a lower office or not.
The best argument against democracy is a 5 minute conversation with the average voters.
Winston Churchill.
Thank you. Very well explained with great illustrations.
Glad this video was of use to you. Thank you for taking the time to respond 🙌
Long live the republic my 86 brothers! Long live virtue! Freedom! Long live love!
It is haunting how spot on Pluto was about this. This is happening in the American government right now.
lol what a stupid comment....the only time american government goes off the rails is when the republikaans are in government....
The reason why democracy is failing in the Unite States is because the electorate is no longer educated. Democracy is only the best system when the voters are educated and capable of critical thinking. I''m not sure logic, civics and history are seriously taught in school anymore; hence, the decline of democracy. Recently, I heard a young person disparage democracy as "the dictatorship of the majority." That's probably something he heard and that was all he knew about it. That is why I am pessimistic about the future of this country.
Very true.
Really democracy doesn't work anymore. You are indeed a great philosopher
Wealthy countries always develop into people who would rather vote for a living than work for one. You can never become a rich and powerful nation without the great equalizer of politicians and their hoards of uneducated voters who come to take it over.
Best argument against democracy is the comment section of every video possible.
Welcome back bro🤗
Socrates was right. We need a high academic bady which independently tests and evaluates all candidates for presidency. They should be tested on cognitive skills, critical thinking, humanities education, philosophy, and science education. Without these prerequisites NO ONE should be allowed to run for a chance at ruling the nation. Too much is at stake
Mexicos's president amlo, is the proof of how plato was right.
Reason number 2 explains everything.
Wow, still relevant today. That guy was a genius.
I absolutely agree with Plato
One must follow this video for two reasons. The first reason is to see if worth for someone to loose some time to see it. For sure, that is excellent and very useful for many people. Then, one should check the comments and see how it affects to different people. Well, for some is very useful. For some others, seems that you can not teach someone something that he thinks he knows it already.
The Core of the problem is the lack of common Interpretation of life. You have the materialists who believe that materia is everything there is and who don’t accept or even tolerate a beyond. Then you have plenty of people who don’t even care about the existence or absence of any meaning, who numb them selfes with material goods and constant entertainment. And you have the various different spiritual outlooks who hope in an afterlife, Act according to their revelation or codex or act as complete hipocrites. Now, only the fact that you, as an individual, are every day confronted with completely different outlooks on what life actually is, wears your System down and creates a constant or even evergrowing anger towards society. This will increase over decades to come. You are mocking the religious wars in Europe in the 17th century where fundamental views collided with each other. Then have a look at what hysteria we are heading towards: Aggression between black and white, car drivers vs bycicle drivers, animal lovers vs meat eaters, heterosexuals vs homosexuals, trans people vs everybody, left vs right (without the people actually knowing where the terms come from and what they mean). What they call progressive Society will slowly cannibalize itself, and. It will hurt. These things were recognized by Platon over 2000 years ago, even when democracy was not yet liberal and was restricted to a handfull of men with similar lifestyle, similar believes and probably way more resilience than modern men
That is an interesting perspective. Thanks a lot for sharing! 🙌
IF people are smart enough, there wouldn't be an actual rift when it comes to preferences, unfortunately people let emotions run their actions and speech over logic and common sense.
@@zaberfang yes, because they are emotional beings. Reasoning is good but of people get the slightest idea of getting treated unjustly they breed hatred. Not over a day, a week, or even a year. But If this goes over years and even decades…
Well, the natural state of humans is based on conflict.
Plato`s "solution" to the problems of Democracy was Autocratic Rule by those who "Know". That those who have the true philosophical knowledge of how things really are. The ideal result for Plato would be a rigid, stultifiling autocracy that was ideally nearly totally unchanging because of Plato's almost pathological hatred of change.
Thus Plato's idea of an ideal society was one in which an Elite ruled with near absolute power over people, in which dissent was crushed and everything was static. Thus in the Republic we have the "Noble Lies" told by the Elite to justify their autocratic rule and "Justice" is everyone doing what they are best fitted for has determined by this Elite and "Justice" has fair treatment is not even considered. And of course Plato's idea that "unequals" being treated has "equals" is unjust is little more than a thinly veiled appeal to the notion that certain people are entitled to more power and priviliges than others including the right to treat others badly.
In Plato's dialogue The Statesman we have an unapologetic celebration of the idea of the Autocrat not bounded by Law with a bogus philisophical justification.
In Plato's Laws we have censorship, sealing society has much has possible from outside influence, thought control and in the Nocturnal Council an inquisition. Plato's solution to the problems of democracy was autocracy and what would amount to coercion, tyranny and terror.
Plato's deep dislike of Democracy was born quite simply out of disgust at the idea that the "unwashed", the "Mob" etc., would hve any say in governing themselves when that "right" belonged in Plato's eyes i nthe hands of a sdmall oligarchic Elite. Then given Plato's Aristocratic background this was a natural belief. Like so many of the Athenian Upper Class Oligarchic sympathizers he believed the Elite, (Meaning others like them.), deserved to rule and like them the masses shouls be obedient to their "betters". Plato was basically a philosophical snob.
During his lifetime oligarchic attempts were made to destroy the Athenian Democracy most horribly during the period of the so-called Thirty Tyrants in which Thousands of Athenian Citizens and others were murdered by the tyrants. Among them was the man Critias a relative of Plato who was apparantly the most vicious of the lot and a pupil of Socrates like Plato. In his Dialogues Plato has Critias appear has one of his characters and gives him a positive spin. It appears that for Plato the death of Socrates forever marred and damned Athenian Democracy but the various bloody Oligarchic coups and bloody rule did not taint Oligarchic rule by those who like Critias "knew".
I have little doubt that any attempt by Plato to impose his solutions on Athens or any where else would have resulted in mass atrocity.
A nation needs a volunteer army to protect itself from outside threats while it remains an anarchy on the inside since all governments eventually fail.
The real question is, in this day and age how do we have a stable gov that isn’t too big and can stamp out corruption?
Great video! Thank you 🙏 subscribed
A few people who aren’t very smart collect all the money at the expense of the citizens lives. It’s a chosen act of neglecting the population. You said it right, keeping power and money.
How can we move forward according to Plato. Racism, fascism, separation wit in a multicultural society. When they keep society divided. Now humanity is living in a world of uncertainty
As a Brazilian, i'm pretty sure things are way more chaotic here than they are in swaziland, bhutan, finland or iceland. Freedom of association is not a bad thing.
No, you're obviously just putting words into his mouth aren't you.
PLATO FOR PRESIDENT he's right they should have some education or time in the political arena before they run for government some experience thank you for the excellent video and have a good evening 😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊.
I enjoyed this, I may have to delve into philosophy it seems so interesting.
Please do! Best wishes for your philosophical journey! 🙌
thank you for this great video
All Plato, is saying, as far as I'm concerned, is to "put only people who aren't corrupt, in positions of power. Which, actually, strikes me as a bit naively lame for such a highly intelligent man. He doesn't give enough safe-guards to account for the flaws, he obviously is aware of, in human nature. Most notably, "corruption." 😎🇺🇸
As long as we live in a service to self world, society wil experience chaos. Only in a service to others world can there be fairness and justice.
Govt should not be involved in redistribution.
China surely uses Plato's method. Only the leader (with specific knowledge) who already proved their ability on local area will allow to move up.
Democracy is the power of the Demos. The Demos in the ancient Greek City States had about 10 to 15000 citizens. There is no Demos with millions of citizens. This is a fairy tale.
To understand how Democracy works and capitalism, stick to the Spartans and learn.(best before the Ephors took over power)
Your commentary is brilliant and the work you're doing is vitally important. If humans don't soon figure out why our so-called 'Civilization' has utterly failed and design a new post-political Governance System for everyone, it will collapse and disappear. Thank you, looking forward to more.
Name of piano piece please?
Thanks for the great insightful vid btw
As long as we are required or insist that we live together in communities called towns and cities where it is beneficial to pool resources like land, water, food, shelter and labour; governance (agreements/disagreements) is inevitable. Two individuals can agree, share and rely most of the time. Three or more individuals will need some form of governance (rules). Those who can never agree; well just look around. As a species, we have not evolved where we recognize and respect boundaries. We still want to move in this world as if there are no consequences to complete freedom to exploit, manipulate, coerce, steal and expunge an unhealthy need to worship at our own feet.
Democracy doesn't work because two idiots will always outvote one smart person.
We see chaos growing right out of governments.
Well! History repeats itself. They obviously had Trumpers back then too. I totally agree with Socrates then plato that you cannot let ignorance dictate who gets elected, it's recipe for disaster. Either limit who votes or prepare your population with a better education system.
Where did you find that great quote at the end?
British democracy has evolved in a two party state that apart from the odd coalition have run the country for over a hundred years,that is to mean Tory and labour.
I find none of the ideals you've mentioned here unreasonable therefore none of them are overly idealistic or un realistic. Can we possibly function as a society if we are in any way unable to cope with reason and reality?
What kind of system should be have?
It's the title of the book.. a Republic.
Benevolent dictatorship works best.
Really good video.
Glad you think so 🙌
What form of government does work? Someone tell me that! Anyway the video confuses democracy with rights. Democracy as we know it is a system by means of which a government is elected. Rights are an innovation of liberalism - equal opportunity, freedom of movement, freedom of the press, free speech etc. Hence the term liberal democracy, so different from the Athenian democracy of ancient times.
Send in the Mandarins!
Right now, Justin Trudeau’s hair is ruling Canada.
My perception: Plato was not against Democracy but against Sub-optimal democracy which is Partial, Partisian and Political. Merit based and Rational rule is desirable be it any form of Government.
Democracy doesnt guarantee Growth. ( example African Nations)
Growth is not only limited to Democratic countries ( Ex. China model although it is facing difficulties now OR Middle eastern countries like UAE).
Which democracy? There's more than one form.
Who will build the roads? Literally the same people
Your accent is like an Indian Christopher Walken
If we did not have government human kind would never extend beyond Tribes and small groups. For no two groups will have a similar point of view and would only work together when survival demands it. Then when things are going well conflict starts up again.
Government is essential to a nation or state to survive beyond survival situations
Thats a misleading title.
Plato was an idealist. It does not work. Even if you find a wise leader (and nobody is that wise), he/she would not be able to implement the good ideas.
Power corrupts, so even if somebody entered an office with good intentions, he/she rather quickly becomes corrupt.
There are good individuals in the world. But once they start to aggregate in groups they revert to being just animals. Read about the psychology of the masses.
It is just impossible. But it’s a nice dream to strive towards.
May you succeed where others failed.
I don't follow. Plato realizes that politicians should focus on their profession instead of their gain. Okay. And the proposed solution is providing everyone with equal opportunity to education to raise the best suited individuals into power? Something is missing here. If corruption is a psychological problem with people having too much power, wouldn't it affect all candidates the same way regardless of their educational qualification? This seems like wishful thinking.
why have we delayed in taking up these sober checks and balances?
Because liberal democracies accepts the riff-raf off the streets, sometimes even after they have served 20 years in prison and obtained a degree through self-education, it permits them to compete with the sophisticated and articulate products of human nurture who ought to be making the decisions in the first place.
I think Michael Malice might have some words to say about the beginning. Pfffft, central authority corruption is necessary. HA! I'm going classic anarchist and leftist here, burn it all down.
Plato reasoned some things correctly, but listen to what Ayn Rand recommended. Learn about Aristotle.
I believe you may be confused if you’re calling yourself a leftist and then recommending Ayn Rand shortly afterwards. Ayn Rand has been described as “the ultimate gateway drug to the right” by Historian Jennifer Burns. Ayn Rand pushes neo-liberal ideas which are centre-right at best, you could call her an-cap
@@MrHardeep95 listen to some Michael Malice or read Anarchist Handbook. Antifa is an example, according to Michael Malice, of classical anarchist thought. Socialism and anarchism were very similar in thought in the 1800s or when it kinda started being spread about beyond one or two people. At least the Anarcho socialist types.
And Ayn Rand ain't a anarchist. She thought anarchism was quite infantile, or at least in denial of the need, even minute, of some central authority to not command and control but to be more like a referee.
Ayn Rand hates conservatives. The same reasons reasonable people and leftists do too. All their faults. They have a strong ass tendency to not want to change in any god damn way. And they'll resort to dominance to get you to follow. Reasoning is off the table. Really though, conservatives and modern day liberals have a lot in common. They tap into the same impulses or instincts. The conservatives just don't have enough support cause their reputation has been ruined over the centuries, so they've lost their balls.
But we all got left and right in us. That's why I said the leftist in me.
As much as I admire Plato’s passion for ideas, I’ll stick with Socrates thanks
Technically, we don't know anything about the real Socrates. He didn't leave behind any written works of his own and thus, all we know of him is through the lens of his supporters/critics. An example of that is Plato, a student of Socrates. Plato presented many ideas of his own through the character of Socrates that he used in his works but in the present day you can easily find these ideas attributed to Socrates. So to believe our perspective of Socrates is correct, we'd have to assume that anybody that knew Socrates and has written about him, Plato being one of them, is telling the truth and being accurate in their description.
@@TheLifeAcademySN Neither did Jesus.
Someone who thinks we don't need governance is definitely an airhead
We are Easily exploited
Plato hated democracy because it meant that my opinion was as valid as his o his fellow elitists.
Democracy is idiocracy.
Ow, My Balls!
The United States doesn't live in a democracy. Are we not a constitutional republic? So why does this video imply that we do?
Redistribution is one of the key reasons democracy fails.
Hooray for Dictatorships!!
Don't you think that natural laws was a good enough? Human self important making laws that demeaning human. If natural laws was as bad as human laws then human can not be this advance
Trudeau is perfect example.
Plato's argument against a democratic system is born from his support in an autocratic system and autocracy can only be born with force. Plato was not a humanitarian, he was an elitist autocrat.
🙄🙄🙄
Being a humanist isn't any better. The decline of the West is proof of this. Seeing as how "humanist" always put "science" over everything else, knowing the principles thereof are just as faulty and imperfect as any other system that exists.
The current democracy is operating under military contract law not federal constitutional law.
The USA is NOT a democracy! We are a Republic! Read Machiavelli's Discourse on Livy
These are ALL copied from Socrates though!
Plato confirms why he supports democracy not opposes it.
We don't need governments. That's your first error. Why should I be ruled by people I share nothing in common with, simply because we live on the same piece of land. Its nonsensical.
Disagreement is welcome! So, what's my second error?
@@TheLifeAcademySN No second error.
@@JeDxDeVu Then why was there a first?
Because a group of people living together would inevitably lead to some form of administration to run things smoothly, otherwise who would regulate price value when you trade with someone else? Who would organise defenses against other groups of people from other lands? If you trespass or kill someone, who is going to hold you accountable? As well as many other things. The state of no government can only work if you live alone, otherwise it is inevitable.
@@baishihua Who would school your children, who would provide food and clothing, who would provide insurances of any kind or health care, who would take care of agriculture, who would take care of recycling. All of these services are provided by private institutions. In countries like South Africa, people rely on private security even low and middle income people for safety. The goverment is not necessary for ever facet of human society and cooperation. They're slow, expensive and unaccountable.
Meritocracy? Sounds like the Chinese Imperial Exams...maybe they lasted over 5000 years because of this. No WOKE need apply.😅
Democracy is just a glorified word.
Every system of governance is the same.
They decide for you wether it or doesn't benefits you.
It can be whittled down to Trump.
Plato’s teachings on this subject is actually Socrates’ wisdom you should look up his views and teachings on this tooic
China is fine example of ideal form of government according to plato.
You mean freezing your bank account without letting you know why??
China is well governed after all. I have seen this democracy in Africa where merit is the last thing people consider when voting for president- in Africa it's all about tribe
Yeah, easily exploitable, aka Americans.
Terrible video! It DOES NOT explain Why democracy doesn't work. It just cries for more equality.
Oh well! Let's see 🤔The total running length of the video is 10 minutes and 19 seconds. The 'equality' stuff is less than a minute. I wouldn't necessarily call that "crying for equality".
@@TheLifeAcademySN it's the last part people remember the most. The "equality" crap does NOT support argument that excessive Democracy leads to tryanny. Last part sounds like liberals promoting "equality" to make Democracy work. NOT!
Plato's view of demcracy is applicable only to a State which has one religion one culture and oneclass.Inclusive democracy of multi lingual cultural and castes is the only form of democracy ,is the need of present time , for the development of humanity.
It will become just as it is a tyranny and then to communism
Good government is an oxymoron 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Not helpful for the modern world at all. At the time of Plato, one would learn all the knowledge available to humans in 5 years or so with á handfull of long-bearded tutors (that is what all princes and kings in waiting used to do, plus learning to fight)...that is what he means when he says they should be trained for the job. Today, no single person can be "trained for the job", and we need to rely on a large body of advisors and technocrats and think-thanks and so on....and politicians are there to decide about what cannot be answered from a book. For example, experts tell us if we build a housing project near the subway station it will be good for the economy of the neighborhood, but if building that project requires demolishing a park, then whether we should do it or not is not a type of question you can find a scietifically trained expert for. This is now the realm of politics.
maybe just one step away from mobocracy? ha................
You need to pass an exam before voting and at least try and stem the flow of stupidity
Yet Americans believe in Democracy so blindly and numbingly…
A lot of us understand to neverunderestimate the power of millions of people united for a stupid idea.