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DIY Fireplace Installation - Natural Gas Line
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- čas přidán 28. 12. 2018
- In this video, I use CSST (corrugated stainless steel tubing) to run a natural gas line to a new direct vent fireplace. I also replace most of the cast iron pipe in my furnace room with CSST and install a manifold to distribute the gas evenly to the appliances.
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Nice video. As a licensed plumber I see a couple issues. First, when using CSST of any brand, it is not good to use dish soap. It is caustic and should be cleaned off after if it is used. Second, never test for leaks by introducing gas into the system. Use a pressure gage. Third, when tightening fittings onto CSST, keep the body of the fitting still and turn the nut only. This keeps the internal washer from getting ruined by the cut edge of the CSST. Last, never add a second point of electrical discharge. This could be problematic in the event of a major electrical discharge like lightening. It could travel through one system, into the ground and out the other system.
Thanks for the feedback
So how would you ground the CSST? Bond to electrical?
@@Jalapenoskyraisin 18awg wire to ground must be under 70ft
@@Jalapenoskyraisin Typical CSST asks for 6 gauge ground to panel.
“Never add a second point of electrical discharge…”
Can you please elaborate on what you mean?
I’m assuming you mean that the CSST should be grounded by way of an existing grounding rod, such as the one already grounding the plumbing system, and not by way of a newly-installed grounding rod as seen in this video.
Thanks for any additional info you can share.
To all these nay-sayers: sure, gas is dangerous., I had to replace my gas furnace two years ago. Got bids for it. But was expensive! I, too, was skeptical and 'scared' to DIY from all the negative comments. UNTIL.... I started reading some of the positive reviews from some of the DIYer's. I had to modify my existing gas line to fit the new furnace. I bought the furnace (local's wouldn't even sell me one.....) and installed it myself! I was able to upgrade to a better furnace modify and improve some duct work and still save nearly $4,000 in the process! I did a lot of research on installations, etc. and watched more than one CZcams video for sure. If people check on local codes and requirements, use 'common practical sense" and observe all safety manners when working with gas lines there shouldn't be any problems. But if you are skeptical ..... then perhaps hire a contractor for your own sanity! PS. I plan on remodeling a house and use a similar system described here. Thanks for the tips and how-to's in this video!! and to those of you with your POSITIVE remarks, comments, and suggestions!!
Thanks for the feedback. Mad respect for you dude! I converted from an oil to a gas furnace in my first house. I didn’t have CZcams but I had my Dad to mentor me back then. I paid a guy to adapt the ductwork for me. YOU are my idol.
BTW, I don’t have the time to argue with all the negativity. I’m no expert so it would take too much to research my responses to not sound like an idiot. 😉
We had a gas leak a couple days ago and need to replace fittings for the CSST in the basement. I was scared to do it myself until I watched your video. I have a neighbor who works for an HVAC company who can double check that I do it correctly, but this will save me a ton of money. Thanks a bunch! Subscribed!
I was going to insert new gas insert fireplace but i was very reluctant to do any work on the gas line until i saw your video. i thought i had to call the gas company to shutoff gas....i wasn't aware of the shutoff valve right outside my house...thank you for making this video and going into detail video...you saved me bunch of money.
Just be sure to get a permit and inspection.
Thanks for the video! I am embarking on a DIY CSST project myself this month, and I discount everyone I see/hear/read to who states ...Only a professional is qualified to do this work...You are crazy to do this yourself...This is so dangerous...and on and on.
If you are:
1. Following your local codes (which @Bob Yehlen missed in his second and third point)
2. Pulling a permit with a plan review with whatever your City requires for plans
3. And having the work inspected and bought off by the AHJ (Authority Having Jurisdiction)
4. Installing per the manufacturers recommendation, direction, and training (when applicable)
Then you are doing everything a "professional" would be doing.
Installing gas lines is not really any more dangerous than working on an ABS sewer line, or knocking a wall out of the living room, if you are doing it correctly. Sewer gases can kill just as easily, if not as violently as natural gas. The same goes for knocking out a column/post in your house to open up the living room, and it turns out to be load bearing. Dead is Dead. Treat any DIY project with respect, don't cut any corners, do your research, pull a permit, and have your work inspected.
As to grounding rods, we don't know what City you live in, or what version of the UBC, IBC, IFC, and NEC your City has adopted. It doesn't matter if you have been doing this for 50 years, if you are not following the correct code, you are doing it wrong.
The current NEC section "250.102(B) Other Metal Piping" ALLOWS bonding to a single or double ground rod, not attached to the electrical panel. It sounds like the city of St Louis has superseded the current NEC and has their own requirements, so we shouldn't call someone out for not following "code" without knowing what codes his jurisdiction has adopted.
My City uses both the 2012 IBC and the 2012 IFC, and they have not adopted the 2015 or 2018 versions, and they do not inspect electrical, but defer to my electrical provider to inspect so I have to pull two separate permits to install a gas line. It comes down to know your code. Additionally I have to sign an affidavit with my Natural Gas Provider that I will occupy the house for 24 months after the work is complete if I am doing the work myself.
My only criticism on your video is your initial pressure/leak testing. I would not recommend doing this with is the gas supply. Get the pressure gauge adapter and bicycle pump adapter, and pump the system up with air. Let it sit ATLEAST the amount of time required by your AHJ (mine happens to require only 30 minutes), and test only your very last connection (usually when you take off the air pressure gauge) with gas. Then retest the entire system with a manometer
The only things that hiring a licensed professional piping installer will give you (over an enormously inflated bill) is they make it EASY since they already know the code and requirements for your area, and they understand the calculations for sizing gas lines off the top of their head instead of having to put it down on paper and think about it.
I have been creating and distributing methane gas for 47 years just to one up the 30 year and 35 year "professionals" that are posting
Thanks for the comment. Couldn’t agree more. The inspector (Freehold, NJ) is a licensed plumber who knows the code inside and out. The cost of the permit gets his advice in addition to the inspection.
I tried to pressure test the entire system, but the regulator on my meter kept releasing the pressure. And I wasn’t about to disconnect the meter and cap it. It wasn’t required by the inspector. He only required me to do the pressure test on the fireplace line. The rest, I tested the old fashioned way, with soapy water, like my dad taught me.
Pros hate DIY channels. I get it. But I’m not trying to convince everyone to do things themselves. Just the ones who want to. The rest will keep hiring the pros. Live and let live.
All AHJ should follow NEC on electrical. NEC wrote by some of the most knowledgeable in electrical safety installation. If your city adopt something else and than even defer the inspection to someone else again than those officials don’t know anything they doing that put your safety at risk. Those officials just want to be different and power attention. They should just follow NEC. Please don’t dispute them professional. I’m talking this as an master electrician, refrigeration, warm air ventilation, and gas piping doing it so many years and still make mistake sometimes. So yes really you need someone need to know exactly what they doing. Those inspectors lot of times they has no knowledge of the trade at all especially city cutting down budget.
Thank you for making this clear and concise video. It saves me hundreds of dollar.
Glad it was helpful
Nicely done both in laying out the plan and with the video. There are tables that show the diameter needed for the supply line based on the length of the run and the BTU's of the appliances. I used corrugated line that was one size up so I could later add a gas feed to a barbeque in the future as the location would be a 12 ft run from the fireplace connection.
Good thinking
Gas has always been the one service that I would not touch, even now, but it I was to put in a manifold I would be putting in cut off valves to each appliance, it may be overkill but it would give me a sense of control.
You can add more, but code only requires shutoff valves close to the appliance, not at the distribution point. So there’s a valve at the furnace and water heater, and another behind the stove.
I would as well, it's much the same as where you place a fuse in case something goes wrong or there is a leak on just one line, then you can shut off that line and vent the area then continue to use the other appliances.
Overkill, Maybe, But I too like the idea of that kind of peace of mind.
Thanks for the video! Using csst for the first time. This has been very informative.
Glad it was helpful
They make it soo hard anymore just to make a single sarcastic remark. I have a similar upgrade mountain to climb. a 140k btu tankless feed 150 feet away from the meter. Three items in total 1. Garage water heater 50 gal. (70 feet) of black 3/4
2.HVAC 3/4 (120 ft) maybe 5 ton for 2400sf 3. The tankless gas supply is from the heater line so no go. and another 30' further anyhow. So I am breaking a coupling before the HVAC and going 1" for that last 50'. The shower will accomodate for 5 + minutes and might be spitting out 110 deg since we are not washing greasy dishes or clothes in there. I bough pipe not knowing the Flex can work easier into the wall. Maybe HD would mercify my return/swap. No showers yet for 8 months, my wife is lovin it.
I guess that CSST has been around since the 80's in Japan. I heard that earthquakes posed an issue with hard piping so a flexible pipe was developed.
It’s so much easier to use!
Outstanding video, it helped me out tremendously. Thanks
My pleasure
Csst flex connectors have been around for decades. Csst tubing is fairly new in the last 15 years. It is free to get a Gastite certificate the whole training corse is exactly what to do and what not to do. Homeflex from homedepot does work but Gastite Flashsheild is way better quality and easier on my opinion.
Thanks
Folks remember there is a washer between the new line and the black steel pipe. You need to ground the new csst line to the black steel. Look up proper csst bonding or grounding.
I don't think it's an actual washer. The videos I was watching on grounding the csst from the manufacturer, only show a ground on the first fitting or the cast pipe, ran to the electric panel.
cool video. just some speculation, with all that work adding a manifold why not buy a shut off for each line? also that style of valve is against my local code. they need hand turn style valves. the pressure regulator has a rupture plate in it that can blow out if you open them too quickly. we always open them slowly because my company has blown out several. thanks for the video.
Thanks
I would of also included natural gas piping outside on the permit for a gas grill
thanks for the vid, real nice and it helped me.
Re: 7:42 I disagree - you want to use the cutter in the other direction, because it stabilizes the cutting arm, and keeps the blade from wandering.
Thanks for the tip.
In another similar video they added gripper compound where the male connector with the washer is attached to the pipe.
Pipe compound is for threaded connections. This is a compression connector so I’m not sure the pipe compound does anything.
Usual method for sizing gas line is the LMR (longest measured run) method. Manifold allows you to size each individual run back to the meter after the main supply line is sized. This system is undersized however using ur manometer the pressure drop for each appliance can be measured. Each appliance would have allowable pressure drop on tbe rating plate. Please do not mess with things if you are not a trained gas technician and be careful folks
Yeah, manifold or not, the farthest appliance is the same distance and the BTUs required don’t change. Seemed fishy to me they approved the plan. Goes to show the government permitting office is VERY different than the building inspector’s office. Like most governmental bodies, the right hand clearly doesn’t know what the left is doing.
In terms of the grounding. The gas pipe needs to be bonded back to the panel not bonded to a ground rod. By bonding it to the panel keeps all the grounding potential’s the same.
Absolutely Right Josh. Two ground systems create different potential which actually create a hazard.
Perhaps it was semantics? It’s technically grounded to a grounded to a grounding by way of the electrical panel. (Just trying to give the benefit of the doubt.) ^_^
Nicely done and cleared up my thought process. Appreciated and Subscribed.
Thanks for subscribing! Welcome to the family!
Good good video. Motivated me to do my own work
Glad to hear it!
Very informative
Thanks
I moved here this summer. There is free gas here on this land, but when it gets under 20 degrees it freezes up and I have no heat. All that gas is heat. I was thinking of getting a holding tank at the house for when it freezes up.. is that possible.. need help please
You need to call a pro.
1: previous comments on testing are correct: use a pressure tester and not gas. CSST is not made to run through wall or out side.
Thanks for the advice
huh? from specs: 【Installation】-High temperature resistance,Low pressure resistance,Explosion-proof and compressive material, it can be installed exposed to indoor light , or it can also be embedded in concrete, or behind the wall in dry wall systems as needed. also Suitable for burial installation,Underground Installation easier to handle Bends around corners,eliminating need for additional joints and fittings.
Thanks for the information great video. How did you make your diagrams?
I use a free website called draw.io for simple 2D diagrams like that. For 3D, I use Sketchup.
@@handydadtv Awesome thank you very much.
Would have put valves on each branch of the manifold
No need; there are valves at the appliances.
@@handydadtv: There might not be a "need", but shut-offs are very nice to have. E.g.if you accidentally puncture the line to the stove, you'll have to cut off gas to the other appliances until that line is repaired or capped.
only thing is that you can't use plastic Jay clips for hanging the pipe
POLY GAS PIPE, can i use without corrugated stainless steel tubing
Check local codes.
Very good job! I wish contractors will do the same
Thanks. Ironically, contractors love to criticize me.
Hello sir! Quick question as I live in Nj as well.. not too far away from freehold I may add! But my question is, did you install gauges along the new line? How does the inspector pressure test it? And also, did you need to keep the gas off before the inspector showed up? Thanks!
The inspector only required me to pressure test the new line going to the fireplace. I couldn’t leave the gas off to all the appliances. It was winter and we needed heat and hot water. So I only installed one shutoff valve on the manifold: the fireplace. I left that off until it was inspected. He required me to install a pressurized gauge at the fireplace end to show that the line held pressure for 15 minutes. Your inspector may want something different.
@@handydadtv your inspector is an idiot, you broke into ALL the lines servicing ALL the appliances, so he should have required a pressure test on the whole system. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Just because the city allows you to do the work yourself doesn't mean you should.
I tested every connection for leaks; he just had me do a pressure test on the one I pulled through the walls. Made sense to me since that’s the one with the risk of puncture.
Hello,nice video. One question,did it pass inspection?
Yes
Excellent
Thanks
Can you use CSST to run from the manifold in the basement, directly under a deck and to a Outdoor gas fireplace?
I don’t see why not.
@@handydadtv ty
【Installation】.... also Suitable for burial installation,Underground Installation easier to handle Bends around corners,eliminating need for additional joints and fittings.
Great video. Learned a lot, thanks.
Nice job. I suspect if you had a lightning strike along your gas line things would get more interesting than just ruined lines.
Oh definitely. Supposedly you don’t even need a direct strike for it to affect CSST. Let’s hope I never find out.
Lol wtf the gasmeter outside the house in the open, thats crazy.
And do u have enough pressure with those thin pipes and lots of connections
Yes. Works great.
Gas meter are only allowed outside where I'm from in Massachusetts, we mainly say its so they can shutoff the gas whenever they want. Any internal meters left will eventually be moved to the exterior.
I live in Ontario, Canada. The majority of residential gas meters are outside.
hey you should have separate shut off valves for each appliance from the manifold and also by code should have a drip pocket in the manifold to trap the impurities of the natural gas before it is supplied to the appliances
It passed inspection. The shut offs are at the appliances.
HandyDadTV I guess you have the drip pockets at the appliances as well
Good to know buddy
I do.
@@handydadtv by adding shutoffs at the manifold for each unit you can isolate each one for any future work or fixing problems without downing everything
are the fittings to the manifold and to the yellow pipe reusable? I need to undo one at the end of the manifold to add on. thanks
Yes, if you’re careful when you remove the lock ring, you can reuse it. I reused the one I used for the demonstration.
I would say your system is undersized for 4 runs… I’ve installed many 5 run systems and make my manifolds with black pipe Tee’s each line having its own shutoff for servicing reasons. And a main shutoff before the manifold usually 1 1/4” black pipe. I use Trac pipe and auto snap fittings this comes from my HVAC supplier… I must ask what material is your manifold made of ? And also pipe dope is far better than tape and always secure your runs with straps. The thru wall wouldn’t meet code in the state I live and I’m licensed in. Just curious a few things don’t look right … Please be safe people when working with Gas and Electric… 🇺🇸✌🏼👊🏼
I’m not sure what kind of metal the manifold was made of. My installation was inspected so I have to assume it was acceptable in my municipality. I’ve since moved into a new house but thinking about adding another fireplace. Never know.
@@handydadtv
Ahh OK …. Codes are different from state to state
Good job is maybe undersize using a 3/4 manifold you never gonna run everything at the same time looks good
Thanks
This man’s house is going to burn down.
Wrong but thanks for your feedback.
Manifold is nice touch, but should have been minimum 1"' to supply all 315kbtu.
Pascals Law of pressure " Exerted to a 1/2 pipe then to 3/4'' pipe and then to a 3/4'' pipe will each have same pressure and you will have a pressure drop So no matter what manifold you have you need Volume So you probably could of ran a 1-1/4'' as close as possible the inside to your manifold Volume
Thanks for the feedback
Your bonding need to connect to the house grounding electrical system not only ground to the grounding rod. Other word your electrical system bond the neutral and the grounding rod electrode together to make the house grounding system.
Ok but it passed inspection.
HandyDadTV I got that sometimes you did it wrong to pass inspection as those inspectors said but that’s not how it said in the code.
It passed inspection but they probably just saw it was bonded and assumed it was to the panel.
In your system you created a second earth ground. These are both earth ground but not equal, as they will have resistance to each other during a lightning strike and cause cause a extra current look during the transient strike.
The lighting voltage will seek the shortest path to earth, and this may pass through one of the grounds but then also pass through the second ground.
Best way is to tie the at all the ends of csst to your panel with AWG6 if under 70 feet runs. That way the current will want to travel through to 6awg to the panel ground and rod and not through the csst, which can easily cause holes/burns from the amount of current.
I just redid my house myself with schedule 40 black pipe, and it's thicker to have less resistance and can take the strike without melting. I still need an earth ground, so there is that bonding to the panel. It's bonded in parallel by the equipment itself, but I want the current to travel through the bonded cable rather than the grounds on the equipment where my gas runs to.
Thanks for the info
@@handydadtv and the black flex no need bonding
I see a lot of rust on your gas meter and piping. On ours the pipe was so rusty it actually broke away where it enters into the house (we face the ocean, so the corrosion is really extreme) - so now I have an annual task of painting everything around the meter and pipes with grey oil base paint.
I hope to move before that becomes a problem!
I'm from New York City and its illegal here to use CSST for gas piping. Great video and great explanation!
NYC has very unique codes for everything! You have my sympathy. Thanks for the comment.
Should plan to relocate, kidding
@@handydadtv yet dummies in the City still find a way to blow up their apartments, every year. eg My former downstairs tenant in the town house i was leasing nearly blew up the house because she was too afraid to complain to the landlord about a gas leak. My wife and I, with our infant son, couldn't figure out what the horrible smell was for months. Turns out the tenant below us nearly suffocated from the amount of nat gas coming from her stove's ruptured flex line. I only put it all together when I was helping her back to her apartment from the hospital and heard a very loud hissing noise when we got to her door. First and last time I was glad to see ConEd, very fast response time. But Yea. Im still scarred from the stupidity of this dummy.
It's all about the "Unions" not wanting a proven safe product for the DIYer.
You messed up big. Always thread the nut unto the coupler thread. Other wise your messing the gasket piece up. Twisting it on the sharp pipe end.
Thanks for the advice
Which part of the country u live that fireplace gas valve still legal?
I’m in New Jersey and it was inspected.
@@handydadtv weird they make us replace that in MN
Good Sir am working this Ms gas pipe line
Please How can i get those gas fitting?
I bought it all from Home Depot.
@@handydadtv it's possible for someone in nigeria to get them?
I don’t know.
which grade for stainless steel - 304 or 316
304
Where did you purchase the manifold from ?
Pretty sure it was from Home Depot.
You added BTU's to your system but doubt you checked with your gas supplier as to if your meter is big enough (looks to be rated for 250k BTU so doubt it- they size by all appliances running). That black pipe is welded steel not cast iron.... You should have run 1 inch to both the water heater and furnace to help carry load. Last, you could have found a section of short pipe between 2 couplings, cut and removed it, replaced one coupling with a union, and replaced the removed section adding a tee in the middle for your fireplace piping.
And forget my comment lol I commented as watching the video lol good job brother
Great video and helpful instruction, about to add a gas line for my stove.
Thanks
Hey nice video. I’ve installed this a few times. Around where I’m from, you also have to ground the csst or whatever it’s called your direction lol thanx for the posting bro
Yeah I installed a grounding outside at the meter.
I been a plumber for 500 years lol. I would like to say, nothing like the real Hard pipe. Black green pipe etc etc..
Posting the video, but not being able to watch it! This is mean!😢😆
Sorry! First time scheduling a Premiere.
Just messing with you. Great and informative video as always.
Καλύτερα και πιο ασφαλές είναι να είναι οι σωλήνες του υγραερίου με χαλκοσωληνες που είναι πιο ανθεκτικοί στις πιέσεις του υγραερίου τα κίτρινα σπιράλ τρυπανε εύκολα και είναι επικινδυνα να γίνει κανένα πρόβλημα η φωτιά από επικίνδυνη διαρροή υγραερίου κανονικά μια εγκατάσταση υγραερίου πρέπει υποχρεωτικά να έχει ηλεκτρομαγνικτικη βαλβίδα να κλείνει αυτόματα την παροχή του υγραερίου σε περίπτωση προβληματος η φωτιάς από διαρροή υπάρχουν αυτοματισμοι και ασφάλεια στο υγραέριο αρκεί τουλάχιστον κάθε χρόνο να γίνεται έλεγχος και συντήρηση .
any Chicago maintenance people here?
why not just spray windex on the fittings?
Never tried
Use only non corrosive gas leak detection fluid, rinse off the water after testing.
this is wrong on so many levels. i will just keep it simple and the mention the first point only when i started to review the footage. if you have one inch supply line, why are you reducing to 3/4" manifold? you could have installed a 1" manifold instead and than take your 1/2" runs. you would have had better consistent pressure. your house.
You wouldn't normally test for leaks by introducing gas to the system. In most cases a plumbing inspector would require a pressure test over a period of time by charging the system with air. Well, at least in my neck of the woods. As a matter of fact as a home owner in most municipalities you can't do you own gas work because unlike electricity gas can explode causing damage or even death to not only you and your our own home but also to that of your neighbors. Additionally, suggesting that one can cut a gas line with gas in it is at best fool hardy!
that is really bad you didnt even pressure test it, and how did you even get a permit with out a actual having a contactor license
Many places do not require the home owner be certified or a contractor to do repairs and/or upgrades. Permits must be obtained where required, and governing code must be followed.
Totally against code in Massachusetts
Passed inspection in NJ.
Gas lines and do it yourself are not a good idea
Smoking around open gas-lines is okay
Normal, If no leakage
And even recommended.
Your Gut feeling is wrong.
Got proof? Give me a reference and I'll write a retraction.
More people die from shocks because most people are not dumb enough to run their own gas lines
Believe me that electricity is much more complicated than gas lines. Or perhaps you don’t believe in DIY electrical either?
You asking for so much trouble.
NO TAPES!
Yellow Teflon tape is intended for gas fittings.
@@handydadtv i dont know much admittedly, but tape wont pass any inspections in Tx and the plumbers ive worked with swear against it.
Wow I guess NJ is more progressive because mine passed inspection with the tape.
This is scary stuff. You have no idea what your talking about. Please noone think this is DIY stuff.
U still with yo mumma ?
You are a little snowflake afraid to come out of mommies basement. Some of us have the skill to do this.
@@camarogs1 I commented on this a year ago, relax. Mommy jokes, you're very mature I see. (Btw I don't and have 4 kids myself). Also, I'm actually licensed to do this type of work and have installed, repaired, and inspected a thousand fireplaces. So yes, some people here are skilled enough to do this. If you think you can learn enough in a 14 min video from a guy who admits to having no credentials or training and be able to do this job safely go ahead I guess. I genuinely hope nothing bad happens. (Not replying again)
I hope he’s not a plumber. Bc a lot is wrong in this video “install”
U full of hot air.
Instead of just saying a lot is wrong why don't you enlighten us with your knowledge and tell us what is wrong?