Got this today and my god I am loving it. I used to use virtual sound stage for placement and I'd use valhalla room as a master reverb. This thing is ,as far as I can tell, just magic and I love it!
It's the first time in ages that I've been caught off guard at how good a purchase was. It's actually increased the value (or viability, at least) of prior VI purchases.
I've been using my reverb in some uncommon ways and finally there is a reverb plugin that do kinda what I've spent hours to create. Finally some innovative plugin out there! SA, take notes!
To be able to have the Violins having a reflection on the right...will so enhance things. I use Cinematic Rooms and pan it right...just for the 1sts. This changes EVERYTHING.
2CAudio has a similar orchestral positioning ability using Precedence and Breeze. Breeze is algorithmic and probably has less of a load than IR; though the Teldex scoring stage is a big selling point of the Berlin Studio Reverb.
Daniel! Frederick here (Yeah that guy). Interesting vid and I love that you are supporting my good friend Peter Roos. Everybody is growing up so quick (Peter and I were part of a midi mock-up group before anyone knew about what was possible with samples. And of course I enjoyed working with you on transformers). Interesting things this convolution offers. Anyway, congrats my old friend.
It’s so great when you have the Teldex Impulse Response loaded as in your example and use it to blend with the orchestral tools libraries that were recorded there. As Air studios to blend with spitfire stuff. Man. I just bought a great lexicon emulation I can’t buy another verb just now but this appears to be game-changing…
This looks great, I have the Vienna MIR, and it is super configurable, but the fact you can just click on sections rather than placing it in an exact spot, makes it so much faster.
I've been looking for something like this that allows you to carefully position instruments in a space. I've always lusted after the Ocean Way plugin. But because I don't have a UAD interface, and because Universal Audio hasn't made a native version of Ocean Way yet, I've had to make due without. Something like this could be awesome.
Very helpful video - one point that I think should be mentioned: you've not accurately explained Ocean Way Studios. You were in "re-mic mode" when you showed the quick demo of it. In "re-mic" mode, you are correct that you do not have access to the dry signal. However, if you look just under the "re-mic" button, you'll see a "reverb" selection, which then allows you to dial in the mix of direct signal and wet signal bc you can turn off the "wet solo" button just above the dial for choosing the amount of dry/wet signal. I usually apply Ocean Way on a bus for instrument groups and then use the send of each instrument in the group to create a sense of placement. It's too bad Berlin Studio Reverb doesn't have a demo - I'd love to see if it does a better job of creating a sense of placement for each instrument. For now, I'll stick with Ocean Way just because it seems both are resource hogs and I do have the UAD processing power to run several iterations of OW.
Beautiful sound. I like the idea of sculpting a room response with various mic positions. Would be great if this became the standard for convolution reverb. The mics not having individual outs is really odd though. Pretty much every sample library gives you that functionality and seeing as this plugin is specifically aimed at orchestral composers, you'd think that'd be a feature. Also, one of your praises for the plugin being "it has the dry signal" is so wild to me. Is there really no dry/wet slider or knob for effects in Cubase? IIRC Live also doesn't have one. People either don't have control over dry/wet or they have to go through hoops to get it. I use FL and parallel processing is so ingrained into my workflow that I just can't imagine making music in a DAW that doesn't give you control over both the wet and dry signal by default. And no, sending tracks to buses and turning down the amount you send isn't the same thing.
This demo is great. We need more in-depth contextual tutorial/examples of Berlin Studio. Love it, but still struggling making it work the way I want to. I'm not an audio engineer, so the more examples in context the better for all of us.
It's my understanding that AIR has a (copyright?) protection over the reverb of the studio. I don't think it's possible to get it :/ Which sucks, because I completely agree with you on your point!
I love how you really give a viewer a full breakdown of what the plugin sounds like! It's the only 'review' that pushes this thing to it's limits and uses it in unconventional ways. The rest is boring conventional orchestral settings only... Me for one I'm gonna buy this as a sound design tool to 'worldize' some of my sounds in drill beats lollllll
How is it performance wise? I imagine using this on groups/stacks to meld different orchestra libraries together, but would need like 20+ instances in a session. Maybe someone tried it on M1 specifically and took a look at performance and cpu efficiency?
So if i wanted to run multiple instances of this, is it going to eat up processor power really quick? Like lets say I wanted to run 5 copies of it, without a pretty powerful computer is it gonna bog down fast?
Would Spitfire even be allowed to capture Impulse Responses from Lyndhurst Hall? I could imagine Air Studios to not be particularly happy about that :o Actually surprised a plugin like Berlin Studios exists, it's awesome!
Impulse Responses from Lyndhurst Hall ? NO WAY !! Years ago we made algo rever presets library for 2Caudio B2 reverb. These presets were created based on Lyndhurst hall audio "analysis" . For half a year we analyzed materials and created presets. The end result was so good that they threatened to sue us.
Looks like Spitfire took your advice Daniel lol some year and months later. Would be veeery interested to see your usual feedback on their Air Convolution Reverb when you get around to it. To your point, them doing this is long overdue, but i guess everything in its time.
I know this is a rookie ? Just to be sure the plug-in is placed on an aux track ? Or is it placed on every instrument that your would like to set them in the Berlin Studio ?
you can do this with any convolution verb: make 2 or more send channels equipped with different mics of same room verb, and just send your signals to all of them. For instance, Altiverb usually has more than 3 mics, including the rear mics, which sound dark. So you combine bright ones and the dark ones, to thicken the sound. Also, altiverb has room size, tail duration, eq, but no stage position. But I use Modern Scoring series, which has stage position incorporated in kontakt out of the box, so... that's that.
I see what you are saying but I don’t think there any impulse libraries that have 3 separate mic positions for every single orchestral seating position all recorded in the same studio which was built for orchestral recordings. It’s about the consistency between different instruments, which I don’t think would be as easy with lots of different impulses. You could pan a signal into a convolution to sort of fake positioning but you would lose the real early reflections which make a difference. Ie violins would have an early reflection from the left wall, cellos would have one from the right wall etc
I tend to load things as inserts, that way you can blend the dry signal in and out much better. Heavy on resources that way but that's how I tend to go!
Ok. So then how do you deal with the source level? Do you have it muted or at 0 in Berlin? Per your demo you show it actually adjusts how the reverb behaves depending on how much source you have. Make sense? Or do you have source in and it also lets up form the main track.
I don't think you can expect Spitfire to change their ways like that. They just make instruments with a highly specific vibe. You can't tweak the sound, only slap post-effects on it. You are not expected to question their room. If you want a different room from their sounds you have to layer the sound with another dryer sound. I'm not saying that I like it btw. I use Labs and BBC sometimes, but I also sometimes find it a bit silly that the least-reverbish setting is already one that has plenty of reverb on it. I think Spitfire is all about background-sounds because of that. You can't put a sound into the foreground that doesn't give you any options. But you can always throw some Labs into some layer and it will do something that can help enrichen the whole here and there. I'm with you when it comes to the thoughts on convolution plugins. The idea to select different room positions, similiar to how it's done in many binaural panners, is really powerful. But it only lends itself to convolution plugins that are based on real rooms. So I can not fully agree with your bold statement, that EVERY convolution plugin should be like that now. I know you didn't mean it like that anyway, but just to be clear for everyone else: There are some convolution plugins, whose entire deal is to let the user decide what they wanna use as their IRs and those plugins usually encourage you to just try sounds that weren't even meant as IRs, to get some crazy impossible rooms. Those types of convolution reverbs will never let you pan the IR across the room anytime soon, because you'd have to define what their position the room even is in the first place.
I find that just loading up the close mic and running it through Berlin Studio makes Spitfire sit really well in the Teledex space. It allows you to mix OT/Spitfire pretty well, while mixing down Spitfire to match the smaller Teledex stage.
Too bad about Air studios and the restrictions. That actually hurts Spitfire. I no longer can fit anymore of their libraries onto my 6TB of storage and therefor won’t be buying from them anytime soon. Too bad they didn’t choose a different hall from the beginning, one where they could have recorded the IR’s.
I believe it’s the first to offer all specific orchestral seating arrangements in an orchestral hall. With 3 separate mic positions for each seat. I have EW Spaces I don’t recall anything like that?
It's funny we get so enthusiastic about the most basic features. In some ways consumer level music tech can be cutting edge and in a lot of ways it's so far behind
You're basically describing how samples USED to be recorded when libraries were nice and dry. And if you can't afford this plugin (it's pricey, IMO), you can always set up multiple microphone busses with convolution reverbs on each and send your instrument to the multiple outs.
I replied to a similar post about my thoughts on this but you would lose a lot of the real recorded early reflections and consistency across instruments if you were simply panning into the same convolutions. It would work as an alternative but it would be quite as consistent IMO. Good idea though!
Obviously nowhere near as detailed and high quality as this one, but didn't Parallax Audio's VirtualSoundStage reverb plugin do a similar thing in being able to place items in an orchestral setup in a room easily and had multiple rooms to choose from too? Wasn't as nice sounding and had such a sexy GUI as this one though!
Unless this video is sponsored, not sure where you guys were all this time. There is Precedence from 2C-Audio (which is a monster) and VirtualSoundStage 2 from Parallax-Audio who are doing this in better since ages.....
@@DS-fi4hf Proper multichannel / ambisonics convolution though isn't it with heights, rears and surrounds like Cinematic Rooms. This is kind of a different beast to this stereo reverb. Simialr to Dear Reality's new Exoverb actually, just more complex / full featured.
I'm really impressed with Berlin Studio's versatility
It sounds so good that I am spreading it on my toast in the morning
Nice to see you on CZcams again. Have missed your Avin' a look videos plus your music!
I’m trying to get back to it a bit more. Thanks for sticking with me :)
This is a phenomenal tool. Thx so much for posting and doing the reviews you do!! 👌👊
Got this today and my god I am loving it. I used to use virtual sound stage for placement and I'd use valhalla room as a master reverb. This thing is ,as far as I can tell, just magic and I love it!
Yes Yes Yes!!!!! 😊
🤤🤤🤤
😁
...
Good to see you back, it's nice to have you display/explain the plug-ins for us.
Purchased. Thank you James for the head's up.
It's the first time in ages that I've been caught off guard at how good a purchase was. It's actually increased the value (or viability, at least) of prior VI purchases.
Love the idea of an "expensive" sound coming from that plugin, and I 100% agree!
Great video, fantastic plugin!!!!!!!!!
Oh man what an elegant GUI, I need this! Seems like it would be super fast to dial in what you need!
I've been using my reverb in some uncommon ways and finally there is a reverb plugin that do kinda what I've spent hours to create.
Finally some innovative plugin out there! SA, take notes!
To be able to have the Violins having a reflection on the right...will so enhance things. I use Cinematic Rooms and pan it right...just for the 1sts. This changes EVERYTHING.
I need to try that! What CR preset do you use?
2CAudio has a similar orchestral positioning ability using Precedence and Breeze. Breeze is algorithmic and probably has less of a load than IR; though the Teldex scoring stage is a big selling point of the Berlin Studio Reverb.
Daniel! Frederick here (Yeah that guy). Interesting vid and I love that you are supporting my good friend Peter Roos. Everybody is growing up so quick (Peter and I were part of a midi mock-up group before anyone knew about what was possible with samples. And of course I enjoyed working with you on transformers). Interesting things this convolution offers. Anyway, congrats my old friend.
Thank You Daniel
lovely playing Daniel
It’s so great when you have the Teldex Impulse Response loaded as in your example and use it to blend with the orchestral tools libraries that were recorded there. As Air studios to blend with spitfire stuff. Man. I just bought a great lexicon emulation I can’t buy another verb just now but this appears to be game-changing…
This looks great, I have the Vienna MIR, and it is super configurable, but the fact you can just click on sections rather than placing it in an exact spot, makes it so much faster.
I've been looking for something like this that allows you to carefully position instruments in a space. I've always lusted after the Ocean Way plugin. But because I don't have a UAD interface, and because Universal Audio hasn't made a native version of Ocean Way yet, I've had to make due without. Something like this could be awesome.
Great demo! Thank you. It would be nice to hear some examples with vocals.
Such Positioning, Panning, including Stage L, R, and Up and Down Stage has been in Altiverb for years.
Very helpful video - one point that I think should be mentioned: you've not accurately explained Ocean Way Studios. You were in "re-mic mode" when you showed the quick demo of it. In "re-mic" mode, you are correct that you do not have access to the dry signal. However, if you look just under the "re-mic" button, you'll see a "reverb" selection, which then allows you to dial in the mix of direct signal and wet signal bc you can turn off the "wet solo" button just above the dial for choosing the amount of dry/wet signal. I usually apply Ocean Way on a bus for instrument groups and then use the send of each instrument in the group to create a sense of placement. It's too bad Berlin Studio Reverb doesn't have a demo - I'd love to see if it does a better job of creating a sense of placement for each instrument. For now, I'll stick with Ocean Way just because it seems both are resource hogs and I do have the UAD processing power to run several iterations of OW.
Beautiful sound. I like the idea of sculpting a room response with various mic positions. Would be great if this became the standard for convolution reverb. The mics not having individual outs is really odd though. Pretty much every sample library gives you that functionality and seeing as this plugin is specifically aimed at orchestral composers, you'd think that'd be a feature.
Also, one of your praises for the plugin being "it has the dry signal" is so wild to me. Is there really no dry/wet slider or knob for effects in Cubase? IIRC Live also doesn't have one. People either don't have control over dry/wet or they have to go through hoops to get it. I use FL and parallel processing is so ingrained into my workflow that I just can't imagine making music in a DAW that doesn't give you control over both the wet and dry signal by default. And no, sending tracks to buses and turning down the amount you send isn't the same thing.
This demo is great. We need more in-depth contextual tutorial/examples of Berlin Studio. Love it, but still struggling making it work the way I want to. I'm not an audio engineer, so the more examples in context the better for all of us.
It's my understanding that AIR has a (copyright?) protection over the reverb of the studio. I don't think it's possible to get it :/ Which sucks, because I completely agree with you on your point!
How does this compare to altiverb?
Kind of cool. A Bit like Dolby Atmos Cinematic Rooms but for Stereo and mic techniques.
I love how you really give a viewer a full breakdown of what the plugin sounds like! It's the only 'review' that pushes this thing to it's limits and uses it in unconventional ways. The rest is boring conventional orchestral settings only... Me for one I'm gonna buy this as a sound design tool to 'worldize' some of my sounds in drill beats lollllll
Now I’m confused should I get this or Seventh Heaven, they don’t do exactly the same thing but both beautiful sounding convolution reverbs to my ears
Thanks mate. Spitfire Air Studios Reverb just been released, maybe a review of it ?
could you recreate this using 4 instances of Panagement 2 as mic positions?
How is it performance wise? I imagine using this on groups/stacks to meld different orchestra libraries together, but would need like 20+ instances in a session. Maybe someone tried it on M1 specifically and took a look at performance and cpu efficiency?
So if i wanted to run multiple instances of this, is it going to eat up processor power really quick? Like lets say I wanted to run 5 copies of it, without a pretty powerful computer is it gonna bog down fast?
Would Spitfire even be allowed to capture Impulse Responses from Lyndhurst Hall? I could imagine Air Studios to not be particularly happy about that :o Actually surprised a plugin like Berlin Studios exists, it's awesome!
Impulse Responses from Lyndhurst Hall ? NO WAY !! Years ago we made algo rever presets library for 2Caudio B2 reverb. These presets were created based on Lyndhurst hall audio "analysis" . For half a year we analyzed materials and created presets. The end result was so good that they threatened to sue us.
Looks like Spitfire took your advice Daniel lol some year and months later. Would be veeery interested to see your usual feedback on their Air Convolution Reverb when you get around to it. To your point, them doing this is long overdue, but i guess everything in its time.
I know this is a rookie ? Just to be sure the plug-in is placed on an aux track ? Or is it placed on every instrument that your would like to set them in the Berlin Studio ?
This sounds good, but I can't hear any difference between the different mic positions?!
2WEI also records their stuff at Teldex sometimes
you can do this with any convolution verb: make 2 or more send channels equipped with different mics of same room verb, and just send your signals to all of them. For instance, Altiverb usually has more than 3 mics, including the rear mics, which sound dark. So you combine bright ones and the dark ones, to thicken the sound. Also, altiverb has room size, tail duration, eq, but no stage position. But I use Modern Scoring series, which has stage position incorporated in kontakt out of the box, so... that's that.
Altiverb does have stage position.
@@ladyville3 Oh yeah, even better! Thanx!
I see what you are saying but I don’t think there any impulse libraries that have 3 separate mic positions for every single orchestral seating position all recorded in the same studio which was built for orchestral recordings. It’s about the consistency between different instruments, which I don’t think would be as easy with lots of different impulses. You could pan a signal into a convolution to sort of fake positioning but you would lose the real early reflections which make a difference. Ie violins would have an early reflection from the left wall, cellos would have one from the right wall etc
@@DJLA This 10 minute video perhaps explains it better with examples: czcams.com/video/EpzNgP8uThs/video.html&ab_channel=audioease .
@DJLA are you using this on the instrument track itself or on an Aux/Send with the Source at 0 or muted?
I tend to load things as inserts, that way you can blend the dry signal in and out much better. Heavy on resources that way but that's how I tend to go!
Ok. So then how do you deal with the source level? Do you have it muted or at 0 in Berlin? Per your demo you show it actually adjusts how the reverb behaves depending on how much source you have. Make sense? Or do you have source in and it also lets up form the main track.
I don't think you can expect Spitfire to change their ways like that. They just make instruments with a highly specific vibe. You can't tweak the sound, only slap post-effects on it. You are not expected to question their room. If you want a different room from their sounds you have to layer the sound with another dryer sound. I'm not saying that I like it btw. I use Labs and BBC sometimes, but I also sometimes find it a bit silly that the least-reverbish setting is already one that has plenty of reverb on it. I think Spitfire is all about background-sounds because of that. You can't put a sound into the foreground that doesn't give you any options. But you can always throw some Labs into some layer and it will do something that can help enrichen the whole here and there.
I'm with you when it comes to the thoughts on convolution plugins. The idea to select different room positions, similiar to how it's done in many binaural panners, is really powerful. But it only lends itself to convolution plugins that are based on real rooms. So I can not fully agree with your bold statement, that EVERY convolution plugin should be like that now. I know you didn't mean it like that anyway, but just to be clear for everyone else: There are some convolution plugins, whose entire deal is to let the user decide what they wanna use as their IRs and those plugins usually encourage you to just try sounds that weren't even meant as IRs, to get some crazy impossible rooms. Those types of convolution reverbs will never let you pan the IR across the room anytime soon, because you'd have to define what their position the room even is in the first place.
I find that just loading up the close mic and running it through Berlin Studio makes Spitfire sit really well in the Teledex space. It allows you to mix OT/Spitfire pretty well, while mixing down Spitfire to match the smaller Teledex stage.
Too bad about Air studios and the restrictions. That actually hurts Spitfire. I no longer can fit anymore of their libraries onto my 6TB of storage and therefor won’t be buying from them anytime soon. Too bad they didn’t choose a different hall from the beginning, one where they could have recorded the IR’s.
Hi DJ, is there any way to setup my cubase color scheme like yours? look nice :p
Hey remind me of this in like 2 weeks when I’m back from the holidays and I’ll see if I can make a video about it. A few people have asked :)
@@DJLA alright! Reminding you in 2 weeks then :p. Thank you DJ!
@@DJLA kind reminder to you. You still in holidays probably. So no pressure :)
EastWest Spaces II also has separate placement IRs recorded (for various of their locations) so Berlin Studio is not the first to do that
It only has front and rear. Very limited.
I believe it’s the first to offer all specific orchestral seating arrangements in an orchestral hall. With 3 separate mic positions for each seat. I have EW Spaces I don’t recall anything like that?
It's funny, they must record the impulse responses with a full orchestra sitting quietly in the seats right?
It's funny we get so enthusiastic about the most basic features. In some ways consumer level music tech can be cutting edge and in a lot of ways it's so far behind
You're basically describing how samples USED to be recorded when libraries were nice and dry. And if you can't afford this plugin (it's pricey, IMO), you can always set up multiple microphone busses with convolution reverbs on each and send your instrument to the multiple outs.
I replied to a similar post about my thoughts on this but you would lose a lot of the real recorded early reflections and consistency across instruments if you were simply panning into the same convolutions. It would work as an alternative but it would be quite as consistent IMO. Good idea though!
Okay Daniel, but my bottle neck isn’t memory but it’s processing.
Obviously nowhere near as detailed and high quality as this one, but didn't Parallax Audio's VirtualSoundStage reverb plugin do a similar thing in being able to place items in an orchestral setup in a room easily and had multiple rooms to choose from too? Wasn't as nice sounding and had such a sexy GUI as this one though!
I guess spitfire listened
Unless this video is sponsored, not sure where you guys were all this time. There is Precedence from 2C-Audio (which is a monster) and VirtualSoundStage 2 from Parallax-Audio who are doing this in better since ages.....
5:34...
MIR Pro 3D is much more flexible imo.
Mirpro doesn’t sound as good, and doesnt glue the instrument to the stage as well as this does.
That’s cool mate, you do you! :)
@@DS-fi4hf You're right, MIR doesn't sound so good. That's why Alan Meyerson is using it.
@@DS-fi4hf Proper multichannel / ambisonics convolution though isn't it with heights, rears and surrounds like Cinematic Rooms. This is kind of a different beast to this stereo reverb. Simialr to Dear Reality's new Exoverb actually, just more complex / full featured.
My main gripe with MIR is that this seems a lot quicker to work with than when I try to position in MIR (3D or previous version)
Totally not necessary