Oil Finish Tips & Techniques - Guitar Builders Basics Episode 184
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- čas přidán 15. 01. 2018
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In this video, Ben is answering your questions about oil finish techniques and troubleshooting.
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Hi Ben, I achieved a high gloss by rubbing the first few coars in with 1200 grit, and then applying on a few very thin wet coats to a uniform shine, and just letting it cure without rubbing it off. I ended up with a nitro type shine, and whilst the shiny coats went touch dry within about 24 hours, it remained grippy for about 6 months.
Thanks Ben, very helpful
I would love a mini-torial on drilling the little access port for the truss rod, routing a channel is straightforward enough but drilling that little hole at the headstock always makes me nervous and I always end up breaking the little bridge over it and having to spend a bunch of time patching it up
For future podcasts, I would love to see tips and tricks about kit guitars. How to located the bridge position? How to make a set neck? How to finish it with stains and oil? How to make a nut?
Not a mini-torial as you asked for, but I would really like to see how Tom goes about getting the Nitro look from finishing oil, as I too would like to achieve a nitro-look whilst only using finishing oil.
Me too! Even a Mini-torial would do, in a partially time lapse manner if needed.
Despite Ben saying the 1500 grit wet'n'dry for applying the oil will act as a sealer, I still can't get a solid surface on knotted and knurled wood using that method. So puh-leese!
use steel wool every 2-3 layers and just keep applying oil, youll end up shiny. from memory i think tom said about 15 layers gets a nitro look
Yeah. Plenty of coats and cutting back.
Is there a reason why my oil finish is still a bit sticky after a week of drying
Ben can you do a mini tutorial on how you crown frets with close up shots & your superb explanation......
Alright that's great...you found the word's man Very very much what I needed to know Doing my first Tele w a maple cap
Currently working on my first actual guitar build.
Already put together a kit guitar. I like how it came out, except for the last little bit of the finish. (Specifically, the clearcoat. It's awful. Probably because I didn't sand enough at the start, though.)
Right now I'm in the resource collection phase, along with squaring up the MDF that I'll be using for designing the template. WooT!
I would love to see a comprehensive comparison video explaining the different types of finish options... oil vs nitro vs poly... oil based vs water based... satin vs gloss... feel, durability, maintenance ect....
I have a tele body i bought yonks ago, which was my first stain/oil finish attempt. As a result of doing it over quite some time, after several coats of Antique oil (each drying for several days) , it has dried to a rather nice (semi) gloss finish. Can i send some photos to share? I have already posted a few pics onto patron page, but i guess it won't be visible to many. Just to show what we can do at home!
G'day Ben
Product question: I make hand made wooden and bamboo flutes and from time to time I have a need to stain a section of a flute a vivid colour. Bamboo is a very hard fibrous and strong wood, yes it is a wood, much like many other hardwoods except that it's grain is vertical. Does your stain penetrate the hardwood you use after it has been sanded to say 20,000 grit? As that is the way bamboo that has had the outer layer remove acts. I us very hard to use inks at the moment and they are not what I would like to be able to use.
This is not really a good question for your tutorials but would help me all the same. I do watch most of your videos and have picked up a lot from you and yours.
Thank you
Tom
How difficult would it be to install a truss rod into a bolt on guitar neck that was constructed without one? More specifically, into a 19.685" / 500mm scale length guitar?
Love the channel by the way!
From experience: if you use 1500 sandpaper on a stained surface, you can damage the stain and leave a nasty mark. Even after 10 thin coats of finishing oil.
I did just that on a guitar I made in a Crimson 5 day course. But it still is my favourite guitar.
The Crimson oil finish gives a very nice shine after many coats. Take plenty of time to let each coat dry or it will feel sticky for a longer time. It feels much better than lacquer. It is pretty vulnerable though.
Ok, help please!
I used the stunning stains and finishing oil (penetrating) before on different kinds of woods, now I am using it on a maple top, at first it was amazing but now I’m at the fifth coat and instead of wiping off nicely like before it became matte and sticky and any attempt to wipe it off just results in an uneven surface and scratches from the paper.
I did everything as the videos explain, do I need less coats on a maple top? Do I just keep going til it turns great?
Thanks.
Im just about to order some of your colour stain, the brown and amber. I want to go for the same colours you find on the front and back of a Les Paul honeyburst, its a Gibson LPM that was sprayed all black by a blind man so ive removed all the black paint and really dont want to mess this up. I appreciate any advice. The plan is to stain then spray clear lacquer over it.
Would you say I could get away with just applying a few layers of oil (3-4) and calling it good? I have an alder body/maple neck Kiesel kit.
Can we use the "Penetrating Guitar Finishing Oil" for a maple neck and the rosewood fretboard?
It would've been a good idea for me to watch this movie BEFORE applying the oil the wrong way. I have a lot of sanding to do now. Would it be an idea to apply bee wax afterwards to get a good shine?
What are the main differences between building guitars and basses? except for the obvious (ie. scale length), are there other things to be considered? what are the differences in the pick-ups?
Question and some advice.
Question: How do you make sure you get the right neck angle on a neck through guitar?
With your finishing oil, may it be as hazardous as the other oils to spontaneously combust when you leave an oily rag laying around? If so, I add the right handling of the rags in your videos.
Advice: As you mentioned you and your team are using gloves. If they work longer than 30 minutes with those gloves there is a high (!) risk that they'll have skin problems in the long run. Skin problems are the number one reason why people can't do their job any longer. If you haven't done it already. Put a skin protection plan in your halls and make sure they follow it. Skin care products are even worse in that situation cause they open the skins barrier for all sorts of harmful things cause it is supposed to be absorbed into the skin. What you need is a skin protection product that stays on the skin instead of absorbing into it. It's not that expensive, it's applied quickly and you won't fuck with your hands when you work with gloves or handle stuff you're not really sure about. I know from your shed days that your lungs already have some damage and now got proper gear but don't forget your skin.
Question for anyone who knows or can theorise... I have a solid spalted beech body which I am treating with a water based wood hardener (it's an American product called PC Petrifier, we don't seem to use water based hardeners in the UK). I want to use the Crimson oil as I've had good results in the past and the test piece of spalted beech looks and feels stunning. I'm concerned that the hardener will not allow the oil to penetrate. In my mind, I reckon it will penetrate a bit but will it be enough to build up a sheen and that silky feel? Don't want to go with a cheap looking PU or other film finish but I have to harden the wood or I reckon it's gonna explode under tension... Jeez... This lutherie lark is a minefield...
Is it feasible to sand back, restain and apply this satin oil finish to just the front face of an acoustic while leaving the existing finish on the back and sides??
Tutorial ideas
creating a body template from scratch
working out where to route the truss rode
aligning an angled (tune o matic) bridge when drilling
how to cut a volute
set ups
drilling output jacks (lp, ot tele style)
Hi, can I use this finishing oil on a Pau Ferro fretboard?
does anyone know off wood suppliers tone woods? i start a flamenco guitar soon. my first build
I use this stuff. In fact, I think the last order was 10 bottles. Almost use it exclusively. Match it with the Renaissance wax. Key thing, that first coat. Make sure you get all that stuff off or you'll be sanding it down!
could you please make a mini tutorial on how to treat cobber AFTER being treated with chemicals - I loose all the blues and green colors with both lacquer and oil
Ben - trying to support you by placing a good sized order back on December 8th. To date I have not received any of the items. I keep being told it will be ready shortly, and I will get a tracking number. Was told it would ship last week. Still nothing. Can you at least ship what you have in stock verses waiting for the complete order? I have two builds waiting for the finishing oil. Thank you.
Can I use your "Water Based Wipe On Guitar Finishing Lacquer" over the top of your "Stunning Stains" once it's dried in?
Boiled Linseed oil. Watch some tutorials on gun stock finishing, you will get a glorious finish after a LOT of polishing and rubbing!
in finishing my guitar with your penetrating oil i have realised 3 coats in about buffing rather than wiping off the excess. i think in trying to then buff on the 4th and 5th coat it has slightly dulled in a couple of places and is a little bit grippy but also very nitro looking. should i leave it to cure for a week and then lightly sand with 2500 and reapply or 'other'
It should be fully dried/cured between each coat or it will remain 'tacky' and have to be sanded back. Also best if it done in a warm dry environment. I have given you a link to a video in which Ben is demonstrating finishing oil. The method is the same as penetrating oil. czcams.com/video/mroo3QWCne4/video.html
Hope this helps. DC
OK mini-torial request: how do you mount pickups directly to the top of a semi-hollow body (your PAF hollow for example)? No pickup rings and not mounted into the body but suspended from the top.
I’d like to see that as well.
You should have put pictures of Tom's master build up here - it's the best finish I've ever seen using only your finishing oil.
A ps to this info, relating to the drying process. As you say, there are 2 drying mechanisms at play with drying oils. The first being by pure evaporation of solvents, if there are any, where low ambient temperatures will just slow the process.
But the second process, cross linking is different. I'm sure there are some forms of metal-complex driers in your finishing oil, perhaps cobalt, surely not lead these days, and these facilitate the proper polymerisation of the oil chains. Problem is, though, if it's too cold, the polymerisation is inhibited and the improperly cured oil will never cure properly - even if you stick the item into a heated place later. Once the oil goes through a poor cross-linking pathway then there is no going back and you are left with a weak, even cheesy film forever.
Question is, how cold is too cold for your Crimson Guitars Finishing oil? Not sure what the situation with other products, typically True Oil, is either but I'm looking up at my thermometer (next to my barometer, hygrometer, UTC clock) and it strikes me that 12C is bloody cold, perhaps too cold for finishing oil.
Hey Ian, I think 12 is too cold.. we haven't done the test ourselves but I'm going to as the chemists to let me know and will answer this properly in a WOTB episode soon! B
Great stuff as always, Ben. Question: have you ever tried using automotive paints on a guitar? I work for an auto parts warehouse and can get paint at a nice discount. I would dearly love to put on a candy apple red finish that looks like you could fall into it. Is this possible and if not, why not?
Just curious, but why? are you painting metal or plastic? Kinda seems like more steps, fumes, etc. You can pretty much replicate a certain color used on a car, although... I've always loved metal flake, like, a seasick green flake would be kinda boss as a finish.
Well, because I can get the paints at a discount, so the cost is really reasonable to get enough to cover a guitar. It was something I thought I would try mostly because one of the guys here at work has done quite a few custom paint jobs on cars for things like the Woodward Cruise in Detroit and the Metro Cruise here in Grand Rapids, and I can pick his brain. :)
Oh you're from Detroit, nice! I lived near Woodward Ave. as a kid for a brief time. Sounds great! That's really cool they still have cruises, too!
I have a tele copy I sanded down and had a friend paint with a car paint-white sparkle that changes tint with the angle. My advice is either use pore filler or primer first. Use the right spray equipment for the PAINT. It helps to have a friend who KNOWS about painting cars. Good luck.
Thanks, Robert. That was the plan on the primer. I was planning on an initial coat of primer, sand off the "cottage cheese" an then another coat. I suppose I could test it on some scrap and see if it works. Hmmmmm....
What about a matte oiled finish with wax
I agree, it is always best to get it all off before you start buffing haha
Hey Ben, I have a 100+ year old piece of reclaimed barn wood that I would like to make a guitar body out of, but it's a bit "cupped." The board is about 60"x16" so it's too big to run through a planer, what would be the best method to flatten it back out? Thanks!
Try looking at Jay Bates on CZcams. He did a video where he flattened his bench top with hand planes.There are many other similar videos on CZcams as well.
Would Christopher work on a ukulele, do a fret level or re-fret and set up?
Clareguitar Darren Defaoite, haha, yeah I love mine but I know it could be better.
Yeah it's all good bud :) My guitar playing is very limited, so it's nice to find something that's easy to play :)
Did u say drip? That has quite a different connotation over here.
I'm so frustrated from just finishing my 12th build and the finish turned out like garbage ..... ... 12 guitars in when I am finally making them not have build issues , yet my finish makes them look like it's my very first ...... ..... tried lacquer on most and poly on the others all.with the same result when i do the wet sand and buff stage..... severe scratches everywhere some deep, and long, some very small, hideous......
So it's during the buff out? Maybe some loose grit from the sanding process are still floating around.
w13rdguy these scratches are definitely from sand paper .....
What kind of sandpaper are you using and what grits? Leave that info here for someone who has more insight in the sanding process than I do.
onpsxmember .... I think it all came down to the buffing compound I'm using.....
What are you using? Just for all of us to avoid it.
At 1:34 Does Ben shit himself?
lol. looks like.. B
First.
Goddamit. I actually commented "First" What a loser, eh?