The Great THUNDERBALL Debate! | Calvin vs. David
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- čas přidán 5. 09. 2024
- WARNING: This extreme debate of two Bond fans, one who loves THUNDERBALL and one who does not, is not for the faint of heart. If you have severe medical conditions, sensitivity to flashing lights, and get woozy at the sight of blood, then take caution when watching this video. No Bond fans were seriously hurt in the making of this debate....allegedly.
Special thanks to Calvin Dyson for being an amazing foil in this discussion!
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When David is not running an advertising and marketing company, his hobby is The Bond Experience which is primarily a video blog where he discusses Bond experiences and the people and brands that help to create those experiences...
David has been featured and sourced for articles in Time Magazine, The Boston Globe, The Courier Times, USA Today, Star Magazine, MM&M, The Exchange, The Guardian, The New York Times, Bond on Bond, American Media Inc., AP Wire and online social media outlets. David has been a speaker at Johns Hopkin, Hofstra University, Columbia as a Bond Experience expert. His collection represents one of the most complete example of Bond lifestyle items. Invited to cover Tom Ford, Omega, Heineken, Coke, Orlebar Brown, NPeal, Floris, Lock & Co., Sunspel, Turnbull & Asser, and a multitude of location partnership events, David has represented social media experiences for many years. In addition David has provided props and decor for Johns Hopkin Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace Premieres as well as the Devereaux Foundation 007 Fundraiser. The mantra of living like Bond, one moment at a time emanates from a concept of experiencing the joy of collecting small moments in life that add up to amazing journeys and stories....
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The Bond Experience is not affiliated with any James Bond copyright holder and is an unofficial entity.
Fun discussion! A note for Calvin, though, who says that he can't tell who's who during the big climactic underwater battle...
Repeat after me, sir:
Largo & the SPECTRE frogmen are wearing black wetsuits.
Bond & the US Navy frogmen are wearing red wetsuits...
Largo & the SPECTRE frogmen are wearing black wetsuits.
Bond & the US Navy frogmen are wearing red wetsuits...
Thunderball, in my opinion, had the best bond girls as a group. Molly Peters, Luciana Paluzzi, and Claudine Auger were in my opinion the best of the bond girls as a complete set. Other than that I love the films with the scuba diving scenes.
How u gonna leave out Martine Beswick one of the hottest 007 girls ever !!
Best Bond girl's thumbs
What about Paula?
Honey bears for sure. My personal favourite honey bear is Martine Beswick in Thunderball.
Claudine Auger....my single favorite Bond girl.
Thunderball is an absolute masterpiece. My Dad and I watch it every summer. I absolutely love the Bahamas. This film is timeless
Bingo!
Definitely 👍, super cool and you see the Action and Budget on Screen. Love the Brutality in the Combat Diving Scenes....
I thought it was Connery’s best Bond film.
I agree that Thunderball is timeless. Time definitely feels like it's standing still while watching it.
Yeah, the Bahamas location is a winner in my book- I went as a kid, and twice on Spring Break in college, during Junkanoo, and of course felt more than a little connection to Bond.
Personally, Thunderball is one of my top 5 favorite Bond films of all time. I enjoy just about every aspect of it from the locations to the music, and I think that Dominio is a great Bond girl. I do agree with Calvin that Largo isn’t a particularly interesting villain, but that’s never bothered me because it’s already established at the beginning of the film that Largo is second-in command at Spectre behind Blofeld, and the filmmakers knew that they were going to show Blofeld in the next movie. So my guess is that they didn’t want to make Largo so threatening that Blofeld doesn’t seem that intimidating by comparison, because then it wouldn’t make sense why Largo is taking orders from a less threatening villain, but that’s just my opinion.
Also I don’t know if anyone would agree with me, but when watching the Bond films in chronological order of being released, could you go watch Thunderball and go straight into watching OHMSS and OHMSS would still make sense? I understand that you would be skipping over You Only Live Twice, but In OHMSS Blofeld acts like him and Bond have never met before. I know that Bond was wearing a Japanese disguise in YOLT, but by that point in the film the disguise was basically gone. Am I the only person who thinks this?
I myself believe the code name theory.
Team David on this one. Thunderball is awesome.
This movie could cure insomnia. Team Calvin!
I used to consider Thunderball to be a lesser (not bad) entry in the series but as I’ve gotten older I’ve grown to love it. The story is serviceable but what really brings be back to it is the beautiful aesthetics, extremely cool and even relaxing atmosphere, beautiful locations and people, and the copious amount of memorable Bond moments like him using the Femme Fetal as a shield then walking off like nothing happened, casually setting off the fire alarm at the spa after taking out a baddy, or even just him outsmarting Largo with witty one liners.
Agreed. Initially I found it a bit hard to sit through, but later I grew to love it. It's in my top three I think.
This is really interesting. I almost never agree with Calvin (Moonraker? Really?) and almost always agree with David. This time however, I think Calvin is in the right. I always had my reservations about Thunderball, especially coming after the masterful Goldfinger. Calvin described those reservations very well. These are very good discussions for us to be having. As always there are arguments both sides. And for all my reservations about Thunderball, I don't mind the underwater scenes. I thought they were really cool and menacing. Good work guys!
As a fan of Moonraker, this hurts 😂...but everyone in the Bond community has differing opinions!
I saw Thunderball in its original release in 1965 at the Kingsway Theater in Brooklyn NY. I was in the second grade and my dad took us to see it. Even at that young age I knew the film was something special. Everyone seemed to be talking about it. Life magazine put Connery on their cover in his wetsuit. I remember the lines around the block of people waiting to see it. It started me on a life time of James Bond fandom. I even mentioned in class show and tell that I had seen Thunderball over the Holidays. My teacher wasn’t so enthusiastic about that. It has always been and still remains my favorite. It is the Bond movie of which I judge all other against. To me this is the gold standard of all Bonds.
I loved your debate. Both Calvin and David made some great points. It was great fun watching this video. Although I do agree that some under water scenes may have dragged a bit, the shear spectacle of see those Ken Adam designed sets and his underwater vehicles are worth the price of admission. Overall Thunderball has a great story with razor tight direction and editing. Thank you both so much for this.
Team David all the way.I’ve always loved Thunderball.The best Bond actor,best girls,fantastic locations and I love every extended minute of the final underwater battle.
I would disagree wholeheartedly with the idea that Thunderball doesn't appeal to younger Bond fans. This is easily top 5 Bond films for me (I'm 20) and Connery's second best after FRWL. I admit, when I first watched it I found it boring, but Connery is so good and cool, with excellent locations and action, as well as a good villain with Largo that holds up as the best example of a Bond villain being an inferior version of Bond if you will. Largo is very similar to Bond, except Bond is younger, sexier and cooler. Best seen when Bond is with the rifle, taunting Largo. Brilliant film.
it's so awesome to hear that younger fans understand the appeal of Bond, and especially the older Bond movies! big cheers, brother
I remember when I picked Thunderball as choice of a Bond movie viewing over one of my dad's suggestions.
I’m a young bond fan and I love thunderball! 😆
Same. Thunderball appeals to kids a lot
I have a soft spot in my heart for “Thunderball”, as it is my wife’s favorite Bond film, it came out the year I was born, and it brings back memories of me playing with my GI. Joe doll in the bathtub in the 70’s, with his full scuba suit on! LOL
I had the same G.I Joe. My favourite toy of all time.
One of the things I like about Thunderball is the spectre meeting just after the opening credits, i think there should be a video game based on this film, I don't mind the slow pacing of the film at all, hope you have another debate soon,
I love you guys! Lots of laughs! For the record, Thunderball was a Classic.
Thunderball often gets overlooked by Bond fans. I don't know why? Bond Mania was at its peak in 1965 and Sean Connery was at the top of his game in Thunderball. It is easily one of the best Bond films and would definitely make my top five list. Thunderball has one of the best scores by John Barry, the all-time best femme-fatale in Fiona Volpe, and one of the better Felix Leiters in Rik Van Nutter, Claudine Auger is one of the prettiest of all Bond girls in the series. Adolfo Celi as Largo isn't the best Bond villain, but he is menacing and cold; he works for me. Tom Jones performs one of the best theme songs in the series. Many people decry the scuba battle, but to choreograph an entire scuba battle in the ocean with real live tiger sharks swimming around the actors is an astounding feat! Thunderball is an AMAZING film!
Bruh. If anything Thunderball is NOT underlooked. It’s literally the second highest grossing Bond film with inflation, made MORE money than Goldfinger.
You are so dead wrong
Good discussion guys! But you’re wrong about the underwater scenes! I find them to be some of the best parts of the movie!
I agree. The underwater photography is stunning, even by today's standards, and the battle towards the end is incredible.
The underwater score is Barry at his most imaginative and fits the underwater flow in the movie.
The underwater scenes are absolutely stunning but they do drag out a little.
With David on this one - Thunderball is peak Connery, peak 60s Bond and in so many ways a classic of the series, especially in terms of lifestyle and location.
“Especially in terms of lifestyle” sure, lounging around the Caribbean seems like a great time, it’s just stultifying in the extreme to watch
I loved this movie I'm 52 now and watched it throughout my life. Being a Boston guy and going to Cape Cod in the summer I loved the ocean/beach settings, the classic clothes, and very pretty Bond girls. Everything I want in a Bond movie is in this one.
incredible discussions guys! keeping me going during tough times!
I’ve never been a big supporter of Thunderball. However I am enjoying rewatching all the films back on the cinema screens this year in the UK. It’s been incredible so far (3 films in). I feel like I’m watching them for the first time despite having watched these films for decades. So this Sunday is Thunderball and I’m excited to see it as I think that big screen might finally allow this film to gel with me.
Thunderball was the first Bond movie I saw -- at a drive-in, the IMAX of that era. Bigger screen than you get in an indoor theater, but with small speakers you attached to your car's rolled down window.
@Bill...I was born in the early 80s, so I missed the Connery, Lazenby, and Moore films in theaters. That must have been a great experience to view the air and sea scenes in large format.
@@travlishallingquest5719 It was life-changing for me. There were a lot of spy shows on TV (and I like most of them). But seeing Thunderball you got things you couldn't get on TV.
Thunderball is one of my favorite Bond films, amd was the first one I saw in theaters. It had the best music, the best Bond girl, the best movie poster, the best lines, the best clothing, the best scenery, I could go on and on.
I'm pretty much with Calvin on this one Connery is amazing in this one and there are some lines that are just hillarious and well played but i always found the movie in itself quite boring and when you say they are stretching long exposition scenes well yea that's one a the issue with it that is almost never a good thing in movies but i wonder if they edited some parts out and cut like 15 min off the movie maybe it could have work better for me that's of course just an opinion but i'm wondering if the edit could have make the movie more interesting.. and that is like the opposite of my other issue with the editing the jump cuts and accelerations of shots for the fight scene are quite distracting especially near the end of the movie when they fight in the boat it's almost cringe worthy i know it was a technique to make it more dynamic and they did it in other bond movies but this is really too much here.. anyway i don't think it's a bad movie just not as interesting as many other bond films
I’ve never understood the hate on the underwater scenes, I find them so interesting and they’re much better than the ones in For Your Eyes Only for example, the score is also fantastic throughout.
I agree 100%
Though I disagree, I think one of the reasons you might prefer Thunderball's underwater scenes to FYEO's is that the former movie's scenes were actually shot underwater, where as FYEO was shot "dry for wet" due to Carole Bouquet's health.
Yeah love the underwater scenes too
I found the ones in For Your Eyes Only clearer.
At the time it was the first underwater camera footage at that length in movies
That is a GREAT Thumbnail promo!
Joe Darlington at his best!
Thunderball is my favorite Connery Bond film. Personally, I love the big climatic underwater fight scene and the music that goes along with it.
Preach on, brother man.
Not a good Bond movie
One of the most stylish Bond films of all time. The cinematography and set pieces are nicely done and underwater battles are intense. Still don’t understand why most people dislike it. I mean Fiona is one reason I love the film because of her gorgeous but seductive character. 💕🔥
One of the best Bond female villains, who had enough depth to have her own film or books, and let’s hope that someone takes this on board as with the Money Penny Dairies ,books.
I'm not a big fan because the story is pretty boring. I mean why does James Bond even go to the Bahamas? Because the sister of the missing pilot lives there? And why does He suspect Largo is the villain? Oh because he's got a eye patch 😅
The underwater scenes are like a slow mo of a underwater documentary
@@skylongskylong1982 Fiona was one of the best evil Bond girls in the franchise history, and like you said her performance despite being 'evil' had enough depth and enough of the actress' delivery and body language to make you interpret even more depth or personality. I'd love to see more of her, either joining SPECTRE and rising through the ranks or something. And Thunderball itself is one of my favorite Bond movies, feels like it has all the elements.
When he walks in the room and plays back the recording device and appears to count the steps… powerful scene that I’ll never forget.
It's interesting to note that if you compare Calvin and Dave's Bond Film rankings, this film is 17 places apart; more than any other film in the series.
For those who are interested, the average ranking between Calvin and Dave works out like this:
24. Die Another Day
23. A View to a Kill
22. SPECTRE
21. Licence to Kill (WTF?)
20. Diamonds Are Forever
19. For Your Eyes Only
18. Living Daylights
17. The Man with the Golden Gun
16. Quantum of Solace (!)
15. Octopussy
14. Moonraker
13. Dr No
12. You Only Live Twice
11. From Russia with love
10. Thunderball
9. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
8. The Spy Who Loved Me.
7. Goldfinger
6. The World is Not Enough
5. Live and Let Die
4. Tomorrow Never Dies
3. Goldeneye
2. Skyfall
1. Casino Royale
NB: I eliminated Calvin's rankings of unofficial films as Dave didn't include them. Where a tie occurred, I went with which ever film had the highest ranking from either of the two critics.
Great ! Are you sure abour Quantum of Solace, since it is quite high in David Zaritsky's ranking ? But maybe, it was not that high.
@@joeyfiuza Calvin 23, David 9.
@@jackmatthew1880 OK. Thanks !
Three Brosnans in the top 6....
One little correction, Claudine Auger died in 2019.
For viewers in the UK: Thunderball is on the 'telly' tonight on ITV4.
Cheers lad
ITV seem to be doing a Connery marathon as I think OHMSS is being skipped
Talk about conicidence!
Its about time ITV 4 started showing Bond films again.
Who needs ITV 4. Just put on the DVD when one pleases.
Should be fun. Thunderball is a weird one for me. On one hand, has so much going for it - wonderful location, amazing women, great Connery style, underwater stuff, sinister Spectre doings, casino scenes. On the other hand, it's slow, too much! underwater stuff, controversial stuff like the Shrublands "seduction" scene, frantic last scenes and quick wrap up, etc. Overall, a favorite for the good stuff but it can put you to sleep if you're not careful. Good luck in the challenge, will definitely watch.
See you soon!
Thunderball is class - probably the best of the Bond soundtracks. Barry and Connery at their best Bondmelt!
One of Calvin's biggest complaints: that Thunderball completely reveals the villain's entire scheme, is, in my opinion, one of Thunderball's greatest strengths. The audience completely knows what's going on and the villain's plot is very understandable. An opposite case is "Octopussy", where no matter how many hundreds of times I've watched Octopussy over the years, I still have absolutely no idea exactly what the villains' plot is. Largo's scheme is logical, brilliant, and makes perfect sense. I was never confused by the villain's scheme in Thunderball, whereas many Bond movies have villain-schemes that are ridiculously complex, convoluted and almost impossible to follow.
Hmm, I like that about Octopussy, though because it involves you having to figure it out by yourself. Now, Octopussy maybe doesn't to the absolute best job at giving you enough clues, but it certainly makes for a more intellectually stimulating watch than Thunderball.
Also, the book does exactly that. And in even more detail.
Too straight forward and boring. Too much is revealed too quickly. You got to seduce the audience, reel us in slowly.
The general orlov plotting is actually the most plausible and realistic of all bond plots. Orlov wants what will look like a US nuclear bomb to explode in West Germany leading to Western outrage, Western nuclear disarmament, clear the way for the red army to invade and revitalise the USSR. The fourth protocol starring pierce Briston had the same plot but more clearly explained
Having said all that the kamala Khan octopuses storyline is baffling
Perhaps calvin has influenced me to strongly but the whole “james bond figuring out what we already know” thing i do find pretty boring. And the awful climax on the boat is almost unwatchable to me. But i think the rest is ok. I feel that largo looks like a better villain than he ends up being in the film
Looking forward to it I agree with Calvin that they should cut the whole scenes of stealing the missiles as it makes Bond play catch up to the audience which makes it boring imo. Coupled with too many under water scenes. I have edited it down to 1hr 45 mins and imo flows much better
I think your opinion will definitely be discussed...
Fantastic debate!
Calvin has some good points - especially about the beginning where Spectre steals the bombs being so slow -I usually fast forward through that when I rewatch it.
But still...this is THUNDERBALL!
This IS James Bond to me - the scope - the spectacle - the music - the gadgets- the beautiful women - the beautiful locations - the action....and of course, the sheer, unbeatable COOLNESS of Sean Connery as 007.
It just has EVERYTHING I love about James Bond movies!
It even has two of my favorite lines and scenes of the series ...
“ mind if my friend sits this one ...she’s just dead.”
and of course, that scene you showed when
Fiona is in the bath and she asks Bond to give her something to put on and he hands her her slippers.
....Just about as cool as James Bond gets!
LOVING this discussion! Wondering if you had considered this: Thunderball came out in 1965 which (in America) was the height of the "Beach Party"-style teen movie. Over 30 (!) films in this genre came out between 1963-1968, often starring teen dream Frankie Avalon and a former Mouseketeer (Annette Funicello). Obviously they wouldn't flat-out make a "teen" Bond movie, but I feel like the beach elements in "Thunderball" (and Domino, and especially the theatrical poster) could have been cheekily inspired by them to try and bring in that audience.
Thunderball has some elements that I really like. Even Goldfinger is, to an extent, made to a limited budget, whereas the sheer scale of Thunderball is incredibly impressive even when watched today. The SPECTRE boardroom set near the film's beginning is a real visual treat, especially considering that it features so briefly. The pacing and plotting is off for me though. Simply put, the changes the Goldfinger script made to the book actually improved Ian Fleming's story, but with Thunderball I think the changes harmed the story. In the novel Bond thinks his mission is a complete waste of time and that he's been sent to a location where there is no chance that the stolen missiles will be. In the film we're starting to see the beginning of the omniscient Bond who manages (too easily) to convince M to change his mission to go to the Bahamas. Connery is still at something like his peak here, but as Calvin says, he's starting to look a little bored at times. The film is rather too slow for my tastes, but I wonder if the rushed post-production process harmed this part of the film. It really needed Peter Hunt to have the time to take a second run at the thing and tighten up the pace, as he did with You Only Live Twice after test audiences disliked the original cut.
I wonder if this is also a North American vs UK view of what Bond should be about? Lifestyle is probably quite important if you live in Florida or California but as a Brit I want to see Bond immerse himself in girls, gadgets and fighting interesting villains. The locations are important too especially for the cinematic experience.
Thunderball is one of the best!
I put it above all of Craig’s
Connery is Bond
He is super cool and suave
I love Thunderball for the same reason as David. Especially on a summer evening, chilling out with a drink. It's a familiar old friend 👍🏻
Always feel a special place for Thunderball as the return of both Terrance Young and Maurice Binder-and they come back with such flair!
What has this film climbing up the rankings, for me, is the dialogue. Bond has some of the best "Bond" lines and Connery delivers them to perfection. The lack of quality dialogue and the actor to deliver them is the main problem I have with the Craig films. He just couldn't deliver a "Bond" quip. And it was painful to watch.
Did the video glitch at 16:15 for anyone else? Starts to show a second of footage of Bond and Domino then jumps to CAlvin talking editing?
Happened to me too, twice. The scene you mentioned and when they start to talk about Felix.
Yes, me as well. I played it a few times and it always happened. Seems like deleted footage.
For me the biggest problem with TB is it's just more difficult to watch than most bond films. There are a lot of underwater and some poorly lit scenes where the action is hard to follow, while the music is loud and jarring to the point of being offputting rather than immersive.
I have been going to the Bahamas since 1979. Much has changed. Love the scenes in Thunderball that show the older lifestyle and beauty of Paradise Island Connery must have loved it as well. It’s where he spent many years I was there in 2019 and the Ba Ha Mar casino said Bond came back to gamble at 89 years of age and owned a golf course in Nassau. The villains house with the sharks was in deep despair. It was closed up. But I could still imagine Bond running across the top of the roof. It should be turned into a 007 Museum
Thunderball is my 2nd favorite Connery film after From Russia With Love and my 3rd over all with Casino being no 1. The location, the story, the villain, the glamor, the lifestyle and the best Bond Women lineup of all the films puts Thunderballl very high on the list. It has so many aspects that makes this film one of theist Bond films of all time. Thanks I have to rewatch the first half as I was late to the party.
Team David on this one. My dad and I watched this one all the time... it was his favorite. Good job gentlemen fantastic as always.. good to see you did throw Calvin a life ring , very Dr Kutze of you. This means Calvin will be able to return for another episode 🤣🤣🤣👏 take care guys please be safe and healthy 😊
The actress who plays the nurse at Shrublands was Molly Peters and the character she played was Patricia Fearing.
My first Bond film was Thunderball. My parents took me when I was 9 and it was on a huge screen. I had a lot of Bond toys. I remember the cool lunch box I had! Still my go to film. I was hooked in the "being James bond " world. Took up scuba diving, karate, and skydiving!
I'm 22 and I loved Thunderball, it's my favorite Bond film, it is fun, I find it easy to watch, the Underwater scenes are fun for me, and it's just gorgeous lighting, style, and the Bond Girls are among the best in my view.
While I recognise it has some faults (especially its occasional lethargic pacing), I really admire the massive scope of the film, the beautiful exotic locations, the real sense of how powerful SPECTRE is, and Connery is still giving a very charismatic performance. It just needed some more shots left on the cutting room floor and better direction during the final fight on the Disco Volente and it would be top tier Bond for me. And how can you dislike a movie that has Fiona Volpe! ;)
Thunder all is my absolute favourite Bond film. For me, it just feels like all the classic Bond Elements are there. Great score (as always with John Barry), great scenery, the Bond girls are all wonderful (Luciana Paluzzi eats every scene she’s in) and Connery seems more comfortable in the role than ever and not bored like he is in his next two Bond Films. Not to mention my favourite end to any Bond film with the Skyhook extraction as the score comes crashing in. The advertisements for the film are spot on, it is the biggest Bond of all.
This is my first Bond experience in a movie theatre! It all started for me with my liking Bond! But it is still Danie Craig for me. Altho not at the start of 2006!
The best thing about Bond is that there's something for everyone. I sit on the fence between Calvin and David for this one.
"He looks at this world and wants it all"
^ That line always made me think the theme song wasn't about Bond, but about a Bond villain.
Admittedly that the rest of the song would make Largo sound a lot cooler than he actually comes across on screen, but...I could imagine that this is how Largo sees himself if nothing else.
I suspect that metaphorically this would apply to James Bond as well
That's definitely supposed to be Bond. Remember when Bond themes were hot blooded and awesome ? Now we have mumbling kids talking about the pain of lost loves or whatever the fuck they are singing.
"But It Turns Out The World Is Not Enoooooough"
Keep these up guys. And Thunderball is stylish but boring.
That thumbnail!! 😂😂😂🍸
I know...crazy!
I do not know if it is because I love diving, but Thunderball is my favorite Connery film and definitely one of my favorites in the whole series! Absolute great debate! Looking forward for the next one.
Looking forward to this vid. I still have a coconut from inside "the Palmyra" or Rock Point in Nassau, and from one of the palms that was in the movie. Picked it up there after jumping the fence a long time ago.😂 Yours if it fits your collection. 🙂
That coconut is HOT then! LOL
@@TheBondExperience oh I suspect Spectre has given up getting it back by now LOL
why did the video keep jumping, like when David was going to talk about Leiter?
Recorded from a live call, probably a connection drop out
Either a connection drop out or because they had to cut it over copyright if they were showing too many clips
Thunderball is my favorite 007 movie. The music is awesome.
That's true, Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang is a great song especially!
My dad had it on Beta tape when I was a kid, along with most of the Bond movies... and it was very exciting for me in the late 80's to be able to discover the series (both on cable TV and on tape). I appreciate my dad for that & I can relate to David's experience because of my dad's appreciation for the series. Thunderball was exciting & I still enjoy the film.
Yes, this should be fun.
Buckle up....
One of the best in the series.Connery at his peak.Also one of the best pre credit scenes.The John Barry soundtrack is very atmospheric throughout especially when Bond finds the Vulcan.The pacing is just right too. Pity this was to be the last Terrence Young film. It has always amazed me how a 'family' film like Thunderball could have so many grizzly and violent deaths in it! The only thing that lets the film down is the sped up projection in the boat window. Still."you can't win them all".
IMO, the issue with Felix is he had hardly any screen presence. He seemed to be a Jack Lord 2.0, but I heard that in Dr No that Jack Lord really stole Connery's thunder because he was oozing so much coolness. Maybe Connery got upset and told him to tone it down or else he'd slap him.
The only thing really missing from Thunderball is the opening scene from the novel where M lectures Bond on his unhealthy lifestyle.
Omg yeah lol
This used to be my second least favorite Connery adventure but after two rewatchs recently it hopped up to my second favorite adventure of his and second favorite Bond film in general
Glad I gave it a second chance
One interesting fact. Statements like "sadistic brute" and "heavenly choirs" and so on were taken straight from unfavorable Bond film reviews and articles. It was the middle finger from producers for those reviewers who disliked Bond (They did it again in Skyfall when Silva said "Is it nothing left from the old 007?" or something like that). Oh, and I love Thunderball, it's one of my favorite Bonds. Luciana Paluzzi, the best bad Bond girl ever.
when I think of the Austin Powers one billion dollars parody I think of the Thunderball Spectre scheme
Thunderball is always up there for me. It was the first Bond film I owned on VHS. I got it for Christmas 1987 and watched it over and over again. The Bahamas are my fantasy destination. As soon as I sell my children - I'm going there. You're both right about the look of the picture. It looks beautiful and its almost an episode of 'Wish You Were Here', a UK Holiday destination programme from the 70s and 80s. Does it lose pace underwater? Not really, the plot involves bombs on a plane being dumped into the sea....it has to spend time exploring the sea bed and the underwater fight routines are tough enough with two divers, but when you have 45...that's a major feat. Thanks guys enjoyed that.
You know, I don't DISLIKE the film, but I don't quite get the hype. Not even close to Connery's best. Weird lack of urgency to it all, despite the plot.
Yeah I've always been sort of ambivalent to it. Neither the plot nor the action caught my interest.
There's nothing to stir one's interest. The movie just plods along and every so often there is some so-so action sequence. What also doesn't help is the Bond villain is basically jumped up henchman.
In James Bond fandom, I love how all of us can have our opinions, and nobody is toxic about it like other fandoms. I just saw thunderball for the first time and my goodness was it a great experience. It is the first bond movie in the series in my opinion that truly feels like a high-budget, globe-trotting, bad-ass spy experience. I love how goldfinger introduces us to the quintessential Bond Formula. I love the seriousness of FRWL. I love the detective aspect of Dr. No. I just think thunderball went to another level. Obviously simply having a bigger budget does NOT automatically make a movie better, but I truly felt that thunderball having 3 times the budget of goldfinger was a GREAT benefit, which allowed it to feel like a bigger blockbuster type of movie. The sets, the locations, all the underwater scenes, they all really captivated me. Even a simple thing like a massive painting sliding upward revealing a massive spy-map. I also enjoy how much more involved Bond is in thunderball compared to goldfinger. He feels more consequential to the story
I am with Calvin. The only times this film lights up for me is whenever Fiona comes on screen. Her death is the very best in all of James Bond. Another super-cool thing is the way the boat converts into a hydrofoil. So there are some great moments (Largo's death another, as is the casual spearing of the one who never makes love).
I think the derivative nature of the Tom Jones' performance summarises the whole enterprise - a ridiculous intro, overly long and boring first act, bland second act (except for the shark pool, which I remember as a boy, everybody talking about) and the truly terrible end, a race in a boat with the worst rear projection in any major movie; even as an eight year old it felt cheap and unbelievable. My least favorite of the Connery Bonds.
Your analysis is ridiculous & terrrible.
I could watch these two talk for ages
Thunderball may be my favorite Bond film. Marvelous location, lifestyle scenes, every female in the cast is excellent, villain and his henchman are suitably dangerous, and the soundtrack is the best of any Bond film. Lucianna Paluzzi is a standout, maybe my favorite Bond "girl" ever. I love the pacing of the film, I just sit back and let the film draw me in. I also love the underwater scenes and wish I could see the film on the big screen.
I can see the points Calvin makes, but I watched this on video with my family as a kid... and there's just so much fun to be had watching this. I don't mind the underwater action and never once thought it excessive.
Thanks guys for making my day and from helping me all last year
Can’t WAIT!!!
Glad you're joining us, Jeff!
I love Thunderball. Possibly in my top 5 Bond films
I don't get the dislike for Thunderball. It's a little long and could be trimmed down by cutting 5 minutes of underwater scenes and then if the jerky ending was reshot it would actually be up with the best.
As it stands it's easily in my top 10 and probably pushes for top 6..
I used to agree with Calvin, in that I just never really took to Thunderball. But now, I genuinely don’t have a clue what I was thinking! I love it! The plot. Blofeld/ Largo/ Fiona/ Vargas. Wow! Domino! Maybe the best Bond girl. Connery at his absolute peak. Endless quotable lines! Amazing locations! Brilliant score. It’s easily top 10. Probably top 5. Possibly the best! So, I’m sorry to say but I totally disagree with everything Calvin says against the film. I just see it differently. It’s a masterpiece.
hey calvin and david....i did get to see thunderball when it first came out in the theatres and, i've always been more on the '...it's still sean but not one i would go back to that often...' side of things...but no matter the side, these discussions have been great...and even if you agree, keep doing these with all the films...i love just hearing your conversations together...peace a great new year ahead to both of you and yours...rocky
29:20 I had a different take on it, that this is about duty and knowledge of risks. It is the dice that pilots hung in their cockpits, knowing that the chance of their not returning from the current mission was a real possibility. Paula took cyanide. Bond had to look, though he already knew she was dead. The real conveyance of coldness was when Bond asked Pinder to inform Felix, and Pinder says, "Okay." That "Okay" was the really cold part--the reveal to the audience that they're always anticipating an agent's being lost, that they're always thinking, "Any of us could get it at any time and we know it." To me, that one word from a nondescript character whose name I had to look up conveyed the agents' appreciation of the gravity of the situation as compellingly as any mutterings about shouting the odds or having to give in to terrorists.
I remember growing up, I looked to Brosnan as Bond. TWINE and DAD came out when I was a child, and I didn't even know there were other actors in the part.
One day, we're switching channels while on vacation and come across a clip of a gray-haired Sean Connery, and my mom asks "James Bond playing video games?" It was a scene from Never Say Never Again, and that helped me understand that there were more actors in the role.
Some time after, Dad buys a VHS of Thunderball and plays it, and I find zero enjoyment in it except for the jetpack and Domino. Brosnan was still my James Bond.
A few years later, I see Goldfinger, which becomes my favorite Bond film at the time. Sean Connery has been my favorite Bond from that point forward.
Afterwards, I thought "Okay, I'll give Thunderball another chance."
I rewatched it, and...I find zero enjoyment in it except for the jetpack and Domino.
No matter how many rewatches I've had, the only thing that grew on me in the years since is Felix Leiter because he was a recurring character who I enjoyed as an ally to Bond.
To this day, Thunderball is my least enjoyed Connery Bond film, even lower than the unofficial NSNA.
Thunderball is one of the best Bond films.
Thunderballs box office clearly reflected Goldfinger, rather than TB itself. Saw it in 65 as a kid and even then thought it dragged - a bit disappointed. There's all the usual great Bond trappings, and IMO the girls as a group are the cutest of all Bond films, but the editing/screenplay let the whole thing down, and of course the underwater scenes are too long. TB is a tough one to rank - it still reflected the 'golden era', so that buys it a few places, I put it somewhere #15-18, with the low position primarily the letdown factor after the first three.
Great debate as always! I have to say I'm on Team Calvin. Thunderball is just one of those Bond films that do absolutely nothing for me - along with A View to A Kill, even though I'm a massive fan of the rest of John Glen's run. However, I appreciate it much more after having watched Never Say Never Again. I like Klaus Maria Brandauer better as Largo, but NSNA is just way too bonkers and operates with a very surface level understanding of Bond - he travels the world, kills people, and has sex with women. Thunderball truly has that Bond style and feel, and there are moments - e.g. the scene of Fiona driving Bond to his hotel - that are really great and tense.
NSNA's tonal inconsistency is pretty bad. The films shifts back and forth from a thriller with surprisingly dark elements to a weak Pink Panther imitation. There is simply no direction or focus here. Yet on the other hand, there is Thunderball's painful blandness.
This is a fantastic film....but.....this guy does have some valid criticisms of it. I definitely agree with the showing the bad guys do the bad thing at the beginning of the movie. The other thing I'd mention is Largo is such a let down compared to Goldfinger and a dozen other great Bond villains.
Really enjoy the videos with your son. Did you ever notice that he resembles Boris from Goldeneye!
I'm with Calvin again. TB is one of the weaker Connery films in my view but I do prefer it to You Only Live Twice.
Thunderball was one of the first Movies I bought as a child at Walmart( well my parents bought when I begged) I bought it for the vhs cover with connery in that black wetsuit and harpoon. I love Thunderball it’s certainly my 2nd favourite Connery bond film. I can see both sides of the argument at hand regarding thunderball
The line where the ginger bird slags Bond off was a direct quote from a critic about a previous film.
Team Calvin - Thunderball is my least favourite James Bond film of the whole 24. Great debate though! Both points were fantastically made and argued.
Wouldn't granting Domino the boss kill be considered highly empowering?
I LOVE “THUNDERBALL” 👍🏻
Good Bond movie but have a problem with how Bond just happens to be at Shrublands, and stumble across Count Lippe and the whole Spectre plot. At least in Never say Never Again, M sends him there.
Loved your friendly debate. I was born in 1963 and as a child even though I was too young to watch it the idea of Bond fighting baddies underwater excited me as a child. I even had the Corgi toy Aston Martin with all the gadgets. So for me it's always had a special place in my 💓 007
Thunderball is probably the most over-rated Bond film ever. Bigger does not mean better, and Terrence Young's limitations as a director become pretty obvious within the first few moments.