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As someone once said in this platform "Most people do not understand Superman".

Superman's too good to become ruthlessly evil. In the event he did, his morals / conscience would likely win out; he'd depower himself before he went too far.

I hate superman in general

PEOPLE: I hate superman because we can't relate to. DC comics: DC turns superman evil so we can relate to. PEOPLE: I hate evil superman,they make him to stop using his moral core e.t.c. We people we can be evil,we won't stay good for long.How can you want superman to resonates yet you don't want him to grief,turn evil? I'm not against evil superman,the way they give us

4:40 i disagree omniman is a product of his environment just like superman except omniman was raised to be a heartless killing machine by his elders

As someone who used to like the Injustice stories and didn't really like Superman, I agree that evil Superman is just tiresome. I never really liked him because I felt he was too OP or that his stories didn't have much weight but seeing things like the Justice League animated shows and The Death of Superman animated movie and All Star Superman, I've really changed my mind.

You have a point

I have an idea for an evil superman arc. Have be a fight between the original Superman everyone likes and the evil Superman who is just Captain Hero from Drawn Together. This version of Superman is more like his DC animated universe counterpart while the Evil Superman, named Super Captain, is a destructive idiot who barely thinks and destroys everything with his powers because he’s trying to be like Superman, but he’s doing it the wrong way. Plus Super Captain abuses his powers for selfish and lazy reasons. As for Super Captain’s origins, he was just an Lex Corp employee named Gary Loserton, a guy who’s been pushed around by society and treated as nothing more than a joke. One day, he accidentally got exposed in some experiment where Lex Luthor is trying to inject himself with Super Man’s DNA just so he can be on equal terms with their rivalry. Now Gary Loserton got the Kryptonian DNA instead of Lex, but he decides to use his new powers just to show off and get respect.

2013: Ah, cool! Evil Superman seems like a neat idea. 2017: Oh. They’re still going with Evil Superman? I thought they’d abandon that. 2024: *ENOUGH ALREADY!*

Even if they weren't making him evil he'd still be a boring character I watched the Superman animated series back when I was a kid on Boomerang the shit bored me to hell the most interesting episodes was when Batman took his bitch because he peeked under his mask and when Lex Luthor was on screen other than that boring. Even in the Justice League on Cartoon Network even with a team to bounce off he was boring as hell and it was obvious that he was a figurehead and the real leader of the Justice League for that iteration at least was Jon Stewart he kept the team together. I will admit Smallville who is really good at least until the later seasons when they started introducing teenage versions of the Justice League.

The part where you talk about why Superman is a human and connected to us is a reason I believe “and the American Way” is an important part of his slogan. A white man raised in Japan won’t be called Japanese, he will always be seen as an Other. But any sort in America can be an American, it’s part of the idea and identity of the nation. If you’re here and believe in the idea of freedom, you’re an American. Even if you’re from space.

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It's so funny to me how often we get Evil Superman, but we barely get any Evil Batman. Sure, there's the pisshead who laughs and Owlman, but rarely do people want to explore it to the same level of Superman. I guess people just believe too heavily in a traumatized trust-fund baby billionaire over a smalltown hero who selflessly puts the world on his shoulders. (I love Batman, but people treat him like the moral messiah and it's so dumb!)

I hope James Gunn's Superman isn't just good, it makes writers across the entertainment industry rethink the largely imaginary "Superman Problem." Because I swear, if I see one more movie or cartoon or read one more comic book where everyone else in the Justice League does cool shit while Superman is benched for most of it? _Man._ "Oh boy, a comic mini-series where Superman meets Godzilla! I can't wait to see him _sit out at least four of this seven issue series!"_

It's not that superman doesn't have the potential for evil. Despite being superman, he's still only human. I just feel like it usually happens a bit too easily

Enough of Evil Superman, what about Morally Grey Superman where he has a justifiable three strike rule towards his villains where after the third time they reoffend (Via they've been jailed for murder twice before and they're doing it again) he kills them.

The thing is Evil Superman is a very interesting concept it's just become slowly an overused trope in the last 20 or so years. The reason it's such a good concept is because the whole idea of Superman is that he's the most moral superhuman in the entire dc universe but if you were to invert his morals he'd become one of the biggest threats earth could ever have

I liked Brandon Routh's Superman. He was good and joyful, but touched by sadness. He was fully human and yet he felt isolated

While I do still appreciate injustice for what it is, I couldn't agree more. I wasn't a big superman fan until recent years and really only liked him in the Justice League animated series, but I watched the Superman vs the Elite movie and it shot him up to my top 3. I think that movie really incapsulates what makes superman so great, pushing that evil superman to the limit with the elite acting as a foil. And the final scene not only is incredibly satisfying, but fully proves what makes the bright and hopeful superman the best superman. That movie made me want to watch so much more of him and with My Adventures coming out with a second season and a good version of superman (hopefully) from James Gunn, I'm hoping for more popularity for a character that people think is boring.

Evil cannot truly create good, it can only warp good into more evil.

Question: how do you feel about the JLU Justice Lord's interpretation of an evil Superman?

i think an evil superman would work if it came from the idea of "superman saves the world but it wont save itself" it would be interesting, to see how the strongest person in the world would take over because he is sick of seeing all of the evil that keeps on repeating itself. I dont know what other people would think of this though

glad you mentioned injustice because while the idea of him becoming evil from a mental breakdown gone on too long could be interesting, man basically flips the switch immediately, basically becoming the logic jason as red hood criticised batman for. revenge killing the joker makes so much sense it's a plot hole he's still alive, but that doesn't logically lead to overthrowing governments and killing protestors, or even murdering super powered bank robbers. and hell it doesn't even explain how wonder woman becomes evil within the story, flash green lantern and zesam all make sense and batmans flawed ideology is proven right by the instant 180 in supes. i know the comics try to expand it but there he murders the green lanterns with the yellow power ring and just decides to get rid of it and never decides to use it again to maintain his rule when he's already far gone. like if redsun supes is the equivilant of owlman then injustice supes is the equilivant of the batman who laughs. i don't mind him snapping from the trauma but the entire justice legue not noticing he's not himself and trying to stop him? really?? it doesn't just betray him, it makes the entire justice legue irrelevant in their own story.

I think a well written evil superman is possible but like needs the story not give Superman/Clark a single bad or single bad experience and boom he snaps n is exibiting traits he never had till that switch is flipped, like red sun superman is that imo he had a good reason to flip that switch going from killing [redacted] and taking there place being that tyrant and we actually see the decend into a tyrant till he is stopped not "boom lois is dead and boom that means Clark/Superman is evil because ooooooh[killed what made him human](killed his loved one) and sure most people will get revenge but thats the lancer story(more of a batman story/arc not supermans) sure hed still do actions that could be taken as Revenge but he wont pull the trigger if he had a choice for the 'criminals' life because (usually) Superman is the boyscout because Heros need something to inspire to be in any form its why stories that have "you are just as special as superman you just gotta choose to be like him" is special to me because thats what imo Superman is about being the first hero that gives other heros and people to look up to and aspire to be, GreenArrow could have a situation that makes him think of his actions when before he use to do what he did no questions asked but now Superman saving people and doing whats right helps GA better himself 'so i could be as good as superman' kinda thing(not saying GA needs it Specificlly just using him as a example)

Superman and Lois and My Adventures with Superman both do Superman right. Still we need a theatrical film that nails his character again.

Another reason why it does not make sense for Superman to go evil if Lois Lane dies is that Superman is often presented to be immortal, or at least going to be alive for an extended period of time in comparison to a regular human. So Superman presumably has already come to peace with the idea that he's going to outlive Lois Lane. Also he must have also come to peace with the idea that his involvement with Lois Lane, no matter how much he attempts to keep it covert, also greatly increases the chance that she will meet an untimely end from one of his many villains. So it seems like it would be very unlikely that the demise of Lois Lane would come as some sort of shocking and unexpected situation that completely upends Superman's entire moral framework. I also very much agree with your assessment of Bill's monologue in Kill Bill 2. So many people seem to forget that Bill is a psychopath and what he is saying about Superman is incorrect. I think this monologue is sort of the "patient zero" moment of the weird evil Superman infestation that has been so prevalent in media since then.

"Superman, but evil" misses the ENTIRE POINT of Superman.

You should do the same video but about Batman, like how The Batman(2022) is one of the best depictions of him, considering it actually understands the core tenants of the character. 1. He's a symbol of hope for the citizens of Gotham. 2. He's got so much compassion and love for humans that I'd argue it's an even stronger part of HIS character than it is Supes'. 3. He DOES have a superpower, and that superpower is his inhuman level of willpower. No matter the odds, no matter the foe, Batman will NOT give up until everyone whom can be saved IS saved, including his enemies like Joker and Bane.

Superman, a symbol of justice, hope, and the best parts of humanity... now a brooding, miserable, violent, untrustworthy force of nature, just a hair's breadth away from becoming pure evil. I'd say it's representative of the current times, wherein people no longer see hope and optimism as realistic or even worth considering.

See, Evil Superman can actually be done really well. Red Son does it well, Kingdom Come does it well, the Justice Lord arc from Justice League not only does it well but then sets up the Cadmus arc where the main Superman could fall. Hell, Marvel's Squadron Supreme series written by Mark Grunwald does a good evil Superman and its fucking Marvel. The thing that these stories get right is that Superman (or his pastiche in the Marvel book) is still Superman, but he is being faced with complex moral issues he's struggling with and unfortunately makes the wrong choices. In Red Son he's still helping people but starts going too far with his methods but it is still from a desire to actually help. Kingdom Come is similar where he goes too far because he enters into a very shaky situation he is not as well informed of. In the Justice Lord arc, the world is on the verge of World War 3 because of Lex so Superman has to make the difficult situation to kill him to keep the world safe and again, his methods which are meant to better mankind go too far. Hyperion in Squadron Supreme is also in a similar situation. Because a major villain took over his and his team's minds, they inadvertently ruined their world and have decided to not only bring the world back to normal but improve it. Good intentions, but they go too far as the situations get more complex and more grey and they get more desperate to do what they think is right. These evil Superman stories are Superman (or a pastiche) that we all know, trying his best but making the wrong decisions in difficult and complex situations and that is why they work. The reason shit like Injustice fails is because it doesn't have Superman, it has an unstable, godlike alien with an enabling demi goddess at his side who quickly becomes an unstable murderer who has no qualms about murdering children and has no self awareness about his actions. In the first game, because Metropolis doesn't approve of him murdering Lex, he sends Doomsday, freaking DOOMSDAY to flatten the town. In the second game, Braniac captures the entire city of Metropolis and Superman freaks out as if he didn't just try to have one of his most dangerous enemies slaughter the entire city...its stupid, it makes no sense, its not Superman. You want to tell an evil Superman story? Then you have to actually write SUPERMAN. If your take of the character wouldn't be recognizable without the appearance...you might as well make a new character like Homelander or Omni-Man. Those characters work and are awesome because they take what we expect from a Superman like character and turn it on its head without actually making Superman himself do anything heinous. Either write an in character Superman at his down fall or just make an asshole with Superman's power set, don't tarnish the legacy of a popular and influential character just to satisfy your lust for brutal violence.

"All it takes is one Dead Lois for even the sanest man on earth to go insane" - Probably the Jonkler

"Studios have always tried to make Superman edgy" sure, if you ignore the Christopher Reeve movies

Think it speaks volumes how, in the original Injustice in-game story, the only thing that could finally stop the evil fascist Superman was..... the actual good Superman everyone knows and loves.

“As much as betrayal of character as giving Batman a sunny disposition.” Not that I disagree with the larger point, but Bats being the broody edgelord is a relatively recent phenomenon. There’s a reason Adam Wests’ incarnation is as campy and fun as the comics were at the time.

Evil Superman is lazy. The origin of Superman was to show the best of Earthlings. To display what humans have forgotten. To show them to aspire to be better. An evil Batman would be more interesting.

I also hate evil superman. For someone who's supposed to be the physical embodiment of someone who can help everyone, they've been leaning too much into "i've got superpowers so I'm better than all you plebians" and "humanity is a flawed species" tropes

"Are you Superman because you're Clark Kent?" "Or are you Clark Kent because your Superman?"

Superman is Clark Kent's "Customer Service Voice"

Evil Superman and a Batman who kills should only exist in alternate universes.

Its a really boring overused concept really.

Even in Injustice, when the "original" heroes travel to the Injustice reality, they get in a war that gets very unbalanced, but when the "original" Superman comes in, you FEEL the hope and bright he brings by his mere presence. So even in the "Patient Zero" that started this GOD AWFUL TREND, they respected Superman.

I don't even need to watch the video. I agree. Evil Superman is boring and shite. I can appreciate some Suoerman archetypes being evil, Homelander (tv version) is a treasure. But evil Kal El is lame.

Because he was once new, but now he is stale. Subversions stop being fun when THEY become the mainstream.

2:22 I only kind of agree with you on this point . Clark lost his wife and his unborn child and the whole city that he swore to protect I think that would be a horrible truth to know that they died at your own hands. This interaction between Supes and Batman in Injustice: Gods among us kind of stuck with me: “I lost my family to crime too, Clark.” “But you weren’t the gun.” While I’m also tired of evil superman I wouldn’t say that it “didn’t take a lot for him to turn evil”

In the original injustice game, Joker didnt just kill superman, he made superman kill Lois. . . and Metropolis. In one of the interactions, Batman mentions how he lost his parents and he didnt become a tyrant like Superman. Superman's response, which goes hard, was "You weren't the gun" which makes sense. Batman lost his parents, not Alfred, not Gotham, just his parents, as an innocent child that likely didn't have the ability to go evil, and if he did, there's Alfred. So yeah, Superman becoming a tyrant(he didnt become evil immediately) from the original injustice makes sense, just the movie kinda sucks.

Evil Superman can work if you're using it to say something interesting. I love how the Justice Lords story holds up the fascistic elements of the superhero power fantasy to the light and makes us feel uncomfortable for enjoying it.

Justice Lord Superman did Injustice Better

i think the biggest reason why evil superman sucks is Some people Only read things on a surface level. Whats superman? A boy scout, And that's as deep as they ever go. It's why conservatives Like star trek or why some characters are villains go over their heads since They're the main character And that makes their choices Good!

Gods im so happy to finally see people push back against evil Superman. I've hated it for literally years. Injustice was a one-off, maybe kinda fun idea at the time that was mostly there to justify the gameplay of multiple versions of the same heroes fighting each other. But ever since it got turned into a comic that started being taken more and more seriously, and started being pushed in other media as well, it very quickly got really annoying. For the record, i believe the same about the other heroes - The Flash, Wonder Woman, and yes, even Batman, are all way, WAY better when they embody the ideals they were designed for.

With so many what ifs you could ask the question of "Are you Kal-El because you're superman? Or are you Superman because your Kal-El?" To see how good it would be