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What Do LLMs Tell Us About the Nature of Language—And Ourselves? - Ep. 23 with Robin Sloan
An interview with best-selling sci-fi novelist Robin Sloan
One of my favorite fiction writers, NYT bestselling author Robin Sloan, just wrote the first novel I’ve seen that’s inspired by LLMs.
It’s called Moonbound, and he originally started trying to write in 2016 with language models. But he found that the models he was using couldn’t quite generate the ambitious creative output he was after.
He did, however, find himself utterly taken by LLMs and their inner workings. He thinks language models are language itself given its first dose of autonomy. He has a deep fascination for and understanding of technology, language, and storytelling-and he weaves all of these together in his book in a way that helps us understand LLMs as part of a broader human story.
I sat down with Robin for a wide-ranging discussion about technology, philosophy, ethics, and biology-and I came away more excited than ever about the possibilities that the future holds. We dive into:
- Robin’s experiments with AI, dating back to 2016
- The central question humans and LLMs grapple with-what happens next?
- How LLMs breath life into language
- Robin’s pet theory about the interplay between LLMs, dreams, and books
This is a must-watch for science-fiction enthusiasts, and anyone interested in the deep philosophical questions raised by LLMs and the way they function.
If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share!
Want even more?
Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here: every.ck.page/ultimate-guide-to-prompting-chatgpt. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free.
To hear more from Dan Shipper:
- Subscribe to Every: every.to/subscribe
- Follow him on X: danshipper
Timestamps:
00:00:00 - Teaser
00:00:53 - Introduction
00:02:47 - A primer on Robin's new book Moonbound
00:04:05 - Robin's experiments with AI, dating back to 2016
00:08:39 - What Robin finds fascinating about LLMs and their mechanics
00:14:09 - Can LLMs write truly great fiction?
00:27:19 - The stories built into modern LLMs
00:30:50 - What Robin believes to be the central question of the human race
00:36:38 - Are LLMs "beings" of some kind?
00:42:26 - What Robin finds interesting about the concept of “I”
00:49:40 - Robin's pet theory about the interplay between LLMs, dreams, and books
Links to resources mentioned in the episode:
- Robin Sloan: www.robinsloan.com/
- Robin’s books: Mr. Penumbra's 24-Hour Bookstore, Sourdough, Moonbound
- Dan’s first interview with Robin four years ago: every.to/superorganizers/tasting-notes-with-robin-sloan-25629085
- Anthropic AI’s paper about how concepts are represented inside LLMs: www.anthropic.com/news/mapping-mind-language-model
- Dan’s interview with Notion engineer Linus Lee: czcams.com/video/OeKEXnNP2yA/video.html
- Big Biology, the podcast that Robin enjoys listening to: www.bigbiology.org/
zhlédnutí: 289

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Komentáře

  • @vitalis
    @vitalis Před 12 hodinami

    What I don’t like about google apps is that they are in perpetual beta and it can be scrapped at any time. There should be a way to be able to export the data to another LLM

  • @eugeniocg3079
    @eugeniocg3079 Před dnem

    awesome

  • @mostlynotworking4112

    John Vervaeke and Jonathan Pageau have been part of many interesting AI convos

  • @refchannel1167
    @refchannel1167 Před 4 dny

    00:00 I remember when I first saw ChatGPT output writing...it was like so exciting but it also made me really afraid. Impact on Human Intellect 00:32 We've long defined the difference between humans and animals as being about the intellect. 00:35 Aristotle: The life of the intellect is the best and the pleasantest for man...a life guided by the intellect is best. 00:45 Anton Chekhov: The intellect draws a sharp line between animals and man and suggests the divinity of the latter. 01:04 If you're reading this, you probably put a lot of stock in what you know and its ability to let you do your job. 01:15 If AI can write and worse think, what's left that makes us unique? Changing Perspective on Knowledge Work 01:36 LLMs are going to change how we think about knowledge work...how we think about ourselves. 01:42 These days I'm not actually scared. I'm actually more excited and curious and filled with wonder. 02:05 The intellect is that thing that humans uniquely have that animals don't. Understanding Intellect and AI 02:34 The intellect is this gigantic combination of different brain processes that are lumped under a single heading. 03:03 In order to regain our sense of self, we need to create a new sense of separation...redefine intellect to make it work in an AI-driven world. 03:34 Technology can help. Psychology is full of these fuzzy concepts like the intellect. The Role of Lithium in Redefining Concepts 04:05 The drug lithium...helped us pull apart two things that we previously thought were overlapping. 04:39 In the late 1940s, a doctor named J.F. Cade...discovered that the urine of manic patients was toxic to guinea pigs. 05:08 When he ended up injecting the lithium carbonate solution into the guinea pigs, he noticed that they became remarkably calm. 05:38 Lithium resolved their mania. It differentiated manic depression from every other kind of mental illness. Applying the Concept to AI and Intellect 06:35 Once we understand what ChatGPT is and what it does, we can use it to redefine and clarify our previously fuzzy concept of the intellect. 07:08 Technically, ChatGPT does next token prediction...language models are really good at reformatting and reconstituting old knowledge in new and useful ways. 07:38 Language models aren't very good so far at discovering new things...they are incredible at taking the sum total of human knowledge...and bringing it to bear in any given situation. 08:06 ChatGPT is a great summarizer...the sum total of human knowledge currently outstrips any of our abilities to actually use it. The Value of Summarizing 09:04 The emails that I write are primarily summaries of meetings that I've had...articles that I write are mostly summaries of books that I've been reading. 10:01 Once I start thinking in this way, I actually start to subtract summarizing as a skill that is part of my intellect. 10:56 ChatGPT is sort of a lever that becomes a new lens on myself and on the world. Human Adaptability 11:24 We tend to define ourselves by what we do differently from other things, and that sense is adaptable. 11:57 Many jobs are primarily about summarizing today, and those jobs might change dramatically. Cultural Influence on Human Development 12:23 William Buckley...tells the story because it teaches us something about how human beings change in response to their culture and the technology they're surrounded by. 13:21 Henrik argues that humans have evolved brains that allow us to most effectively learn...culture rewires our brains and alters our biology. The Future of Human Identity 14:19 ChatGPT is the latest in a long line of cultural and technological advances that have changed what it means to be human. We don't need neural networks fro AI to tap into our biology, its already doing that in profound ways, especially cultural ways.

  • @cblackall21
    @cblackall21 Před 5 dny

    Thankyou both for the excellent video. I live in Australia and so we now have access to NotebookLM. I've tried it and I'm very impressed-and I'm rarely impressed nowadays.

  • @alegng3625
    @alegng3625 Před 7 dny

    Probably need to use ChatGPT to count how many times you said “like” cuz I honestly lost the track

  • @OriginalDramagirl
    @OriginalDramagirl Před 7 dny

    As excited by this development as I was 30 years ago when I walked into the internet.

  • @bucketofbarnacles
    @bucketofbarnacles Před 7 dny

    Fantastic! Questions for Steven Johnson - When you save a quote: Is the note also saving a link to the quote in the source? - You mentioned saving your prompts: What about having a feature to favourite a prompt? This would amount a simple snippets feature.

  • @drdtucker
    @drdtucker Před 7 dny

    Excellent interview

  • @stephenzeoli8117
    @stephenzeoli8117 Před 8 dny

    I read The Infernal Machine, and it is very interesting and educational and entertaining! Highly recommended.

  • @eugeniocg3079
    @eugeniocg3079 Před 8 dny

    Wow this is crazy

  • @DuncanRawlinson
    @DuncanRawlinson Před 8 dny

    feels like Vannevar Bush's memex! incredible.

  • @NDIDIAHIAKWO
    @NDIDIAHIAKWO Před 8 dny

    Awesome! But, how about the powerful "audio overview" function as advertised by Josh Woodward during the recent google i/o event? I noticed it wasn't among the recent notebookLM update. Any info on that??

  • @eyeseethru
    @eyeseethru Před 8 dny

    Another banger!

  • @TineTheLoveForLifeFoundation

    So entertaining - Love your happy contact to <3

  • @bakersox1
    @bakersox1 Před 9 dny

    Exciting work. Via Wikipedia I learned that today, 6 June the release date, is also Steven's 56th birthday! Great way to celebrate. Happy Birthday, Steven!

  • @coke.
    @coke. Před 9 dny

    I'm very interested to know when the mobile app will be develop/release. It's a great tool but I would like to access directly from the app instead of Chrome mobile

  • @davdfranzen
    @davdfranzen Před 9 dny

    It's so depressing notebook LM is only available in the US 😢

    • @danshipper7738
      @danshipper7738 Před 9 dny

      As of today it’s available in 200 countries!!

    • @coke.
      @coke. Před 9 dny

      @davdfranzen , as @@danshipper7738 mentioned, this is now available in UK and Europe too. Amazing stuff

    • @davdfranzen
      @davdfranzen Před 8 dny

      @@danshipper7738 Wohoo! 🎉

  • @eugeniocg3079
    @eugeniocg3079 Před 9 dny

    The dream of the interconnected note system

  • @eugeniocg3079
    @eugeniocg3079 Před 9 dny

    Love the this show's vibe

  • @eugeniocg3079
    @eugeniocg3079 Před 9 dny

    yesssss

  • @user-or4ks4bs5p
    @user-or4ks4bs5p Před 10 dny

    wtf awesome

  • @JustinJackson
    @JustinJackson Před 17 dny

    That guest list is incredible! 🤩 Reid Hoffman, Steph Smith, Tyler Cowen, David Perell! Wow!

  • @TransistorPodcasting
    @TransistorPodcasting Před 17 dny

    This looks awesome, Dan! Congrats on the launch! 🎉🎉🎉🎉

  • @IanMcclanan
    @IanMcclanan Před 17 dny

    Great promo 💪

  • @tomasflores_art
    @tomasflores_art Před 17 dny

    This is a Preview of a Massive Banquete for the Brain

  • @hello.Loop.lab.
    @hello.Loop.lab. Před 17 dny

    This is 🔥🔥🔥

  • @nicholas7417
    @nicholas7417 Před 18 dny

    This is %100 true, how have not more people seen this, Also who is the lady talking?

  • @pozzowon
    @pozzowon Před 26 dny

    Recipe jifs? You mean recipe gifs?

  • @wakingstate9
    @wakingstate9 Před 26 dny

    Writing prompts isn't film making or creating. It's just lazy.

    • @francisco444
      @francisco444 Před 13 dny

      prompts are used to generate. The film making and creativity comes from the user that gets to deem what he wants and what is useful. don't call it lazy. it's yet another tool to help humans, should we call the leaf blower people lazy because they're using a gas-powered fan to blow out leaves?

  • @MrPhotoDudeYo
    @MrPhotoDudeYo Před 26 dny

    "artists" breaking into the market wanting to make money with tools that are trained on stolen data is the biggest hypocrisy right now... good luck

  • @richardstone3083
    @richardstone3083 Před 27 dny

    Perhaps try to look beyond just race?

    • @francisco444
      @francisco444 Před 13 dny

      we're not there yet, it will probably take another 50-100 years for these cultural norms to fade. be patient and accept those that speak about it.

  • @TheinterfaceTvSeries
    @TheinterfaceTvSeries Před 28 dny

    AI is a wonderful tool for filmmakers and storytellers! Particularly for writers. You have an idea and minutes later it’s visualized! I’m working on an trailer for an action horror script I wrote a while back. As I started generating images it came to my realization that I could actually tell the entire story with images and sound! I might just do that!

  • @GaryKabankin
    @GaryKabankin Před měsícem

    May I suggest to update timestamps? Starting from 0:00:00 strictly will move timestamps from the 'stealth mode' directly into progress bar.

  • @Ryan.G.Spalding
    @Ryan.G.Spalding Před měsícem

    Hat would need to be a gortex type material with thin liner or will look weird and it would be like $100

  • @alananimus9145
    @alananimus9145 Před měsícem

    "If AI and write worse think whats left that makes us unique?" The answer is there is nothing that makes us unique. Humans have always had an over inflated sense of self importance and greatness. We attempt to claim that we are somehow unique and different from *other* animals, and are devastated over and over again when science smacks us upside the head with the fact that we are being delusional when we think such thoughts. We need to stop thinking humans are special. We are not. Here is a real shocker to most people. Our brains work EXACTLY like ChatGPT. We do not directly perceive the external world. Our perceptions (sight, sound, taste, touch, etc) are nothing more than a hallucination generated by the brain.

  • @goodleshoes
    @goodleshoes Před měsícem

    To me, the difference is we are naturally born and artificial life will always he fundamentally different, alien.

  • @snook551
    @snook551 Před měsícem

    Dan, can you give please do more episodes? You are really on to something!

  • @EROSNERdesign
    @EROSNERdesign Před měsícem

    from time immortal, people have feared change, new ideas or new thoughts....change happens...evolve or die...

  • @Octwavian
    @Octwavian Před měsícem

    you actually end up summarizing summaries. and you already know AIs can summarize. what else is there left to do?

  • @bollweevil8112
    @bollweevil8112 Před měsícem

    News flash: you are an animal in a complex society and your ego deludes you, making you think that you’re something more If you like to write, AI will not stop you from writing, but eventually, you probably won’t be able to sell what you write Stop trying to be a robot, start trying to be a human and then there’s no competition from AI

  • @user-hy6cp6xp9f
    @user-hy6cp6xp9f Před měsícem

    This is great and summarizes 😉 a lot of ideas I’ve been having about LLMs and how they’ve changed how I think about myself and how I think in general. I find the skill I value most now is knowing the right questions to ask, knowing how to frame questions, and understanding what the audience I make content for wants or needs to hear. It makes me think of ideas by their context, framing, and connections to other ideas more than the content itself. Bravo 🎉

  • @AetherXIV
    @AetherXIV Před měsícem

    I feel like your advice works for now, but I wonder how future proof it is given the unending upgrades AI is experiencing.

  • @Ramkumar-uj9fo
    @Ramkumar-uj9fo Před měsícem

    I was drawn to the title. ❤🎉. Stephen Wolfram wants LLM science

  • @Ramkumar-uj9fo
    @Ramkumar-uj9fo Před měsícem

    I was drawn to the title. ❤🎉

  • @sonofbaconator3503
    @sonofbaconator3503 Před měsícem

    I just started asking Meta AI about tokens and I learned more in a few minutes than I have in a month trying to figure out this stuff on my own. I've used it to write SQL code in seconds that would have taken me at least an hour. Maybe they're just "summaries", but it's crazy how fast these LLMs are improving so maybe you should revisit this topic in a year or maybe less lol

  • @ForHistorysSake
    @ForHistorysSake Před měsícem

    Well put and articulated. Thank you.

  • @DrWrapperband
    @DrWrapperband Před měsícem

    It's not changing my mind, I've always known the brain is just masses of neurons, no soul or other elitist religious Bull Shit.

  • @santiagomoebio
    @santiagomoebio Před měsícem

    what we are = what we know is already placing ourselves in the space of the machine. My kids for instance are learning lots of stuff, but it's much more important how they learn, and why they learn than what they learn…

  • @alexanderbrown-dg3sy
    @alexanderbrown-dg3sy Před měsícem

    I would agree. Kind of sucks right? That intelligence is actually decoupled from consciousness. It seems intelligence is the dot product of pattern recognition and association. Very interesting thought experiment. Will future systems inherently be sociopathic? What about alien life? I don’t like OpenAI, but they definitely caused a thought shift in so many ways.